- cross-posted to:
- hackernews@lemmy.bestiver.se
- cross-posted to:
- hackernews@lemmy.bestiver.se
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Projects like Plex, they started out from the open source community, had free contributions, and then monetized. People are bastardizing open source.
The reason Plex is as popular as it is is because of their infrastructure and software that lets users stream video and music remotely on any device at the press of a button. That costs money to build and maintain.
Really? Cuz Jellyfin literally does the same thing and doesn’t cost money.
JellyFin does not do the same thing. JellyFin doesn’t securely allow users anywhere in the world on any network to stream your media.
Jellyfin does not handle NAT punching automatically to point that a non technical user can install an app on their TV, see one or more libraries, and connect to my server across the Internet. This is the biggest problem that Plex solves compared to Jellyfin. I can’t expect my parents to install Tailscale or make any changes to their network.
That being said I use Jellyfin. I just don’t share it with my friends.
It certainly doesn’t cost what they’re charging. They have a cache, a relay and an auth service. I’ll grant them some more allowance for an active security team. They’ve wasted manyears on features nobody wants and have eliminated any feature that costs them any amount of money to maintain if they can’t make money off it. (sync, client serve, yada yada)
It certainly doesn’t cost what they’re charging.
That’s how services and products work. If they sold their product at cost, they’d go bankrupt. They’re actually charging peanuts for the service they provide.
Their entire infrastructure required to do that proxy and caching is at most 10k a month. Thats a couple thousand users.
What you’re actually paying for is their research and development of all that add ridden content they’re trying to shove down your throat. Then selling your data, and selling you and your watchers ads.
That’s some really expensive peanuts you’re suggesting
Really? Because folders on a hard drive and the OS’s networking does all that… what am I missing?
Remote streaming securely and easily is what you’re missing.
It’s not really about cost for me. Accounts in control of someone else and increased fees to use my own hardware can take a long walk off a short pier.
If only people applied these principles to all software…
In fairness to Plex, I bought a Lifetime subscription during a Black Friday deal over a decade ago and it’s still serving me well to this day.
I have jellyfin set up ready to go but Plex has the UX down at this point. I’ll keep using it whilst my lifetime subscription remains valid.
Same here, JF is on reserve but I’ll be sad if I ever need to switch. Ever since they fixed downloads I have 0 major complaints. Plex just works, and it works very well for my and my family’s needs. I am perfectly happy paying once for software that I use every single day.
God I hate their last UX change. It’s like they specifically designed the roku client to hide your own content and favor theirs, used to be one click into my library and everything was there.
You were right to switch whether the price increased or not.
I have a Jellyfin server as backup, but its clients are shit for anything that uses subtitles. I bought plex pass years back for $80 on sale, can’t complain, but I’m never going to wholly rely on something closed source that requires online credentials.
Plex is a series C for-profit company and is 100% beholden to its investors who expect a handsome return on investment; the enshittification & price hikes are literally guaranteed to continue. Existing users can, and should expect to be squeezed for profits until they have nothing left to give
Strange, I haven’t paid another cent since I paid like AUD$50 for the lifetime pass well over a decade ago.
There are two ways to increase profits:
- Charge more for the same services
- Remove services or features from paid subscriptions
Plex has done 2 a few times now.
If you like being told you can stream remotely and then later have the feature yanked and slapped behind a paywall, then by all means use Plex.
I bought a lifetime license on day 1 iirc. I wanted to support the software that was so good and better than everything else at the time. I have had zero features yanked.
I want to stream remotely, share my library, and watch on any device I come across, so I’ll use Plex.
That’s all well and good for you, but they pulled many rugs out from under free users. This is arguably bad, depending on who you ask, but they most certainly did flat out lie about, which is the core issue.
There’s no “rug pulling” for free users. Expecting a service run by a for-profit company to keep everything free forever is naive and just plain dumb.
This is arguably bad, depending on who you ask, but they most certainly did flat out lie about, which is the core issue.
What did they lie about exactly?
deleted by creator
You can’t say their service hasn’t gotten worse though :)
I paid $75 USD, but they took my plugins, (pour one out for youtube on plex for my DanTDM obsessed kid back in the day) made my interface hard to navigate, try constantly to shove their own content down my (and my users) throats. Hey, remember when you used to have that sync feature that kept you up to date with a selection of titles, then you could use the client on your phone to serve to other phones even offline, god that was awesome with kids on vacation.
made my interface hard to navigate
How? What is hard to navigate in Plex?
try constantly to shove their own content down my (and my users) throats.
I assume you don’t know you can customize your home screen and menus? You can only have your own content showing if you want.
You can’t say their service hasn’t gotten worse though :)
I absolutely can. It has only improved since I’ve been using it, which is from the very start.
How? What is hard to navigate in Plex?
That last ui update was a open abomination and every plex forum out there was all over it, you can’t hide that by saying nuhhahhhh
Since you’re so enamored with plex and I’m quite versed on it, Let’s talk about the horrors of plex
They are collecting data on your and your friends, what you’re watching and what media you have. If the country or state you live and ever decide to go after pirates, they will absolutely hand that data over to whatever state wants it for a song.
Using plex is selling your self and your family out.
They have consistently removed features that people loved and used to focus on delivering you ad content and enshittifying the average experience until they pay. And how much are you paying to watch your own content? What other services could you be spending that on?
I assume you don’t know you can customize your home screen and menus? You can only have your own content showing if you want.
I assume you’re either shill for the company or an outright PR plant, that last ui change was pushed to put their content first. that’s BS. I had my stuff customized, I disabled their crap, they undid it again. My family had to have me go and dig through those tiny top menus on roku to find my own shares. The average person watching my stuff complained to me that i put ads in my stuff. that’s not by fucking accident, it’s a business decision to give me and mine worse content so they can make an extra buck off me. Every change they make is company first, every requrest we make is forums for user helpful change is years old.
The whole company is absolutely horrible and selfish.
I absolutely can. It has only improved since I’ve been using it, which is from the very start.
How about give me examples instead of just shilling. The people here are owed the truth, not your company first attitude.
Several years ago I was looking to set up a media server and initially grabbed Plex because I’d heard so much good about it at the time. The moment it asked me to create an account with Plex during setup and I discovered this wasn’t optional I immediately uninstalled it.
I remain baffled that anyone was okay with needing an externally managed account in order to use software running entirely on their own hardware, let alone the litany of additional enshittification that has happened since.
Their centralized login and services offer some pretty good upsides, that is, before the company started enshittifying the hell out of us.
Anyone you want to share your stuff with, they make an account, They see your server and your content. There are no ip’s, no ports, no configuration.
They handle a limited quality proxy, you’re users behind CGNat? They can still watch your content. Don’t want to open your firewall up? It still works for limited quality.
They cache TheMovieDB, being good neighbors.
They cache EPG, making live tvguide data work for people with tuners.
They provide you with a credible SSL. Your traffic is opaque to your ISP and your network.
They provide you with 2FA.
That said:
- You are the product
- Your users are the product
- What you watch is tracked
- What your users watch is tracked
- Their clients are not your friends.
That would be fine for an optional account if you want this features and the tradeoff that comes with it. Making it mandatory is bad.
I fully agree that what they did is openly bad. Just that it’s not for nothing.
When plex initially exploded in popularity, the alternatives required like manual xml config, constant babying the database, and generally barely worked.
Plex had apps on all the devices from wii to your phone and just worked. There was also lots of promises of privacy, you owning your data, segregating accounts to coordinating direct access, etc etc. It was almost a no brainer because there was no alternative that could deliver that experience.
Now is very different. The vibes at plex are very different, the world is a lot more hostile to privacy, and there are open source alternatives that get very close to the same experience.
So for a lot of people, yeah, plex doesn’t make sense anymore.
Yeah if I were starting now I’d be looking at jellyfin. But I paid the lifetime plex pass, and inertia/laziness what it is, so I haven’t found a reason to actually switch yet.
Neat idea, they don’t interfere with each other. Run both so that when plex finally fucks us over, we just stop using it.
I thought the same until I was bored one saturday afternoon and set up jellyfin as something to do. I haven’t taken my ples server offline only because I don’t want to help my users switch.
Same. I’m kinda half migrated running both but plex is convenient and (for me) still free.
Networking is a big aspect. I have almost 40 friends on plex, about 10 of them actively use my library. I also have access to 8 other plex servers in my circle. And I can put all the “latest added episodes” up on my homescreen with a few clicks.
With jellyfin I’d have to have at least 8 different accounts on 8 different instances.
And while the social aspect isn’t great, I found a few interesting people by looking at plex reviews of recently airing shows. Or just finding people through “friends of friends”.
There is a lot of things to be gained by having a central account and a connection beyond just very selective accounts on your own server, it really shouldn’t be that baffling.
Plex is a really nice app. And the people who really like it justify in their head the need for the external account. Some will twist up into a froth arguing the need for it.
I think some people may get too emotional over such matters. But if it works for them, carry on my frothy friends.
You clearly don’t understand why Plex requires an account then. Hint: it’s for the features that make it the most popular and best self hosted media server software on the market.
Truth is, 99% of people really don’t care.
I was a big supporter of PLEX for a lot of years but I don’t want all the streaming options and ads and crap it was giving me. All I want is a solid media server application and Plex was no longer it.
JellyFin has been fantastic. I’ll never go back
I got Plex set up for my media server literally the day before they hiked the prices. I was weary about the $150 lifetime and couldn’t afford the new price when they changed it so I went to jellyfin.
Turns out jellyfin was everything I wanted and free. Bought 5 years worth of unlimited hosting and a domain name for less than a month of Plex and now I’m well on my way to a pirate media empire.
Just wish I had anyone other than my spouse to share if with… Or that I could figure out fucking MusicBrainz…
Hey I’m just learning about Jellyfin and have one question that maybe you have a take on.
How do we know that Jellyfin isn’t just one step behind Plex on the enshittification scale? Is it structurally different somehow? Open source or something?
There was a time when Plex was the bees knees and everyone loved it, and now they’re putting th screws to us. Why should we believe another group won’t do the same?
Everyone else has the real details, but from my very amateur perspective thee big part is that it’s not connected anywhere else and it’s open source. I have to have an account with Plex to use Plex, so no matter what I do I always have to have there permission to get in the building. Jellyfin runs on my own box and stores its files in that box. I even know the exact directory my account is in. If they decide to push an update that doesn’t jive with me, I just won’t update my machine. If it goes off the rails at any point, there’s at least thousands of jellyfin users that actually know what they’re doing and we’ll have a new jellyfin with black jack and hookers in less than a fortnight.
Jellyfin is FOSS. Taking a single step towards the Plex route will be going against the ethos of Jellyfin as a whole. It is community owned - rather than private, and if there are unethical practice’s involved, then people can and will jump ship forking the whole project at nearly 1:1 scale.
Because of the way jellyfin is built and the underlying philosophy. It can’t enshitify that easily as Plex - it will need a massive community effort to change it.
It is also useful to read on the history of jellyfin as it does highlight some useful pointers.
That’s all correct, but… we aren’t absolutely in the clear. JF could absolutely be forked, DB changes enacted, security added, but you also need all those client devs to come along.
It’s not quite like most Foss where a couple people could jump in and do a better job, JF has a LOT of moving parts supported by a number of individuals.
Also, Plex controls the login/authentication through their portal, and can also receive data back from your host regarding the content being shared/watched.
Jellyfin is 100% locally configured accounts
Jellyfin itself is Emby. Emby was owned by a company and it enshittified at the speed of light, and that’s when Jellyfin was born (by forking the last open source version of Emby).
In the time it took you to write this comment you could have gone to the Jellyfin website and read the first 12 words on the page:
The Free Software Media System
Jellyfin is the volunteer-built media solution
I’m never going to apologize for asking questions on Reddit or Lemmy. This is a place for talking to people. In the time it took you to chastise me you could have stuck your thumb up your ass 17 times.
Meanwhile, I got a perfectly good answer from someone else. Thanks for nothing.
I think it just shows you actually don’t care. I think some of the things you asked could be interesting if you had done any of your own reading first and had some context, but what you did instead was ask us to tell you what to think.
You can go do that on Reddit, or do you think that’s where you are now?
I quite like that people ask simple questions like this. Sure, it could have been looked up really quickly, but it adds to the overall thread here. People reading this with no prior knowledge can browse through the comments and absorb more information.
My bad I use 3rd party app clients for both Reddit and Lemmy and they look much alike.
It makes no difference though, because Lemmy is a place for talking to people too.
When you already know the answer it’s very easy to “ackshually” someone and tell them just how they could have googled it in a second.
But when you don’t know what you don’t know, it’s not so simple. For example: when my question is “how do we know Jellyfin will not eventually go down the path of enshittification as well?” It doesn’t occur to me to just start reading their homepage and see if I stumble into an answer. Excuuuuuuuse me.
Anyway…
But, my friend, it is in the article. We’re not hanging out chatting and the idea of Jellyfin came up. We’re in a discussion about the article. You showed up to the book club and asked us to tell you about the book because you didn’t read it.
Gatekeeping lemmy. Classy.
Nah I was making fun of them for initially saying they wouldn’t apologize for asking questions on Reddit, when on Lemmy lmao
As in you set it up outside your home server for only that? What’s the hard drive capacity there? Can you share a link to this offer?
I may not be using the right lingo, I mean I bought a domain set up a tunneling service so that I don’t have have to struggle with keeping it online or teaching the family to use VPNs and stuff. I just give them my website, tell them the account info, and it works on the jellyfin app.
I started selfhosting just because throwing cash on subscriptions at big corpos is not feasible since subs are increasing on a year-on-year basis. To my mind, if I’m going to self-host to yet again pay sub prices defeats the sole purpose of selfhosting.
That money you can pocket and invest in your own hardware for spare parts, upgrades & the like
You could also consider donating it to the projects you are hosting. Because developing that software still takes a lot of labour and these devs really need it
I’ve had so many instances of free to use, lifetime licenses, and purchased software that have turned into subscription services that I refuse to install anything that requires an account unless it can’t be avoided. The fact that Plex required an account be created to view my own local content years before they started charging for use made it obvious subscription fees were coming.
Jellyfin works great. Combined with Wireguard it works great anywhere.
My only hitch making the switch to Jellyfin is that a couple of my TVs just don’t have a jellyfin app whatsoever. I wish they did, I can’t stand all the changes Plex has made over the last few years specifically.
Spin up pihole and just look at the data coming to your “smart” TV’s even when you are not using them. Then consider the data they must be sending home, the only thing “smart” TVs are good at is watching you watch them (or not watching them). I would highly recommend getting a pi or media computer for your TV’s.
I do not think I can stress this enough smart TV’s are not smart for you they are smart for whoever made the TV. Manufactures sell TV’s at a loss now because they get more by selling you.
I have an Nvidia Shield stick that’s android based and one day Google started pushing live Taco Bell ads to it on the ambient Home Screen. That was the last day pi-hole ever let it phone home.
highly recommend getting a pi or media computer
Been looking at this for years, Fam is absolutely refusing to use a keyboard in the living room. They’ll watch on their phones first. I can’t find a clear, easy solution to run a quality remote on a SFF pc. It’s like the decades old mediacenter hole that never gets filled.
Agreed. Watching the queries on the pi-hole dashboard has been eye-opening.
They do not sell TVs at a loss lol.
Retailers don’t, but those $300 60" TVs cost manufacturers more than that in parts and shipping. They are 100% making up for it in LTV from your data, that’s why some are trying to make it impossible not to use them when not connected to the internet.
but those $300 60" TVs cost manufacturers more than that in parts and shipping.
They don’t.
nice argument you place there. meet my blocklist
Wait, you’re that same guy just shilling for plex aren’t you?
Oh my, go check that post history people, they’re either a PR plant or just trolling
Look at an major TV manufactures books and the TV part is a loss, the income they get from the TV is selling you to advertisers.
Look at an major TV manufactures books and the TV part is a loss, the income they get from the TV is selling you to advertisers.
I’d love to see your source for this. I won’t hold my breathe because it’s simply not true.
https://www.fool.com/investing/2024/01/16/people-think-roku-makes-money-selling-streaming-st/
https://www.mensjournal.com/entertainment/tech-smart-tv-screenshots-acr-tracking-privacy-lg-samsung
https://jamestown.org/connected-smart-tv-security-risks/
https://taurusx.com/resource/480275.html
For a peer-reviewed (means scientific) article here is https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/13548565251327885
I guess Sony does not, but they allow Amazon and/or Google onto the TV and if you think they are not getting money from you that way I have some nice ocean side property to sell you here in Saskatchewan.
A cheap device like an Onn (~$20) would solve that, probably without requiring the device have Internet access once set up.
Researching now. I figured there were things out there like that but didn’t know they were so inexpensive. Thanks for the suggestion!
couldn’t you also do a little raspberry pi setup? little more work but a lot more control.
I’d love to! Those things are expensive now though. My old Pi is running my Pi-Hole now. If they were affordable, I’d buy a whole ass pallet of them for all the projects I want to do.
Are they Samsung TVs?
They are, at least the one that’s given me the most trouble is.
I think Jellyfin already released to Tizen OS, although not all model supports it https://github.com/jellyfin/jellyfin-tizen/issues/222#issuecomment-3831638580
If you want to try, it should be possible to install it yourself instead of waiting it to be available in Tizen app store
Yeah, my TV doesn’t have Tizen as far as I know. I found that jellyfin-tizen app and tried manually installing it but my TV is about 8 years old now.
Imo anyone who stayed with Plex after they required you to create an account is insane, especially considering there have always been good alternatives.
This exactly.
I looked into setting Plex up a few years ago. It installed, and then starts talking about making a cloud account. I don’t want to talk to a cloud I just want to organize my own shit on my own network. Why does that need a cloud?
I uninstalled it. Everything I’ve seen since, and I mean EVERYthing, tells me I dodged a bullet. Not once have I read an article that makes me wish I’d continued the install.
Not that I want to defend Plex which is definitely enshittifying, but I don’t think most people are buying Plex to stream their own media. They’re doing it so other people can stream their media. Not wanting to buy a domain and set up port forwarding or a reverse proxy or whatever doesn’t seem unreasonable to me. My grandparents are never going to use Tailscale, and even if they did, I don’t think there are any Tailscale smart TV apps.
Disclosure: I run Plex and Jellyfin (and Navidrome) in parallel, and bought a lifetime pass years ago.
Yeah, I have been learning more and just got oauth working last week. I found Plex a little after blockbuster went under and I had over a thousand movies and a few full TV shows. I have tried jellyfin but the lack of apps has been the issue for me. But as Plex does more of this it will get more and more worthless.
They’re doing it so other people can stream their media
and they went to a subscription model, in part, so they could get their ‘cut’ from plex shares.
100% right on for me. It took me years, YEARS, to get my mother to where she would check if USB peripherals were plugged in before asking me to come over and find out why it was broken. Even the occasional slight complications with Plex get her to where she doesn’t use it for months unless I fix it for her. Jellyfin just ain’t happening with her.
I can’t comment on Plex vs JellyFin, but it’s an interesting perspective that $3/mon for remote access is too much
I use another piece of opensource software, where I consider that a plus. It takes the headache and security issues off my hands, while I can support the developers with a small contribution for an optional feature
$3/mon is $36 a year. That adds up - most people have to work several hours to earn that money.
Plex may also be harvesting your data. When I used it years ago it was already trying to send logs back home, blocked by the firewall.
Plex still costs the same to me. Lifetime pass means no price hike, and it “just works.”
I’ve finally switched to Jellyfin, even though I have a lifetime Plex pass. It isn’t really a downgrade. I think I ran into more bugs on Plex. Using Jellyfin is like switching from Windows to Linux, on a smaller scale. Plex was always trying to sell you something, get you to use the other features, etc, whereas Jellyfin just gets out of my way and lets me watch media.
Sure but Jellyfin just works too so thats cool, it took me like 5mn to switch our devices and the fact I could stream anything instantly on any of them without warning or whatever was immediately a breath of fresh air
Unless you want to stream remotely of course.
But when you want to give access to others outside of your network they need to subscribe to a plan to get a watch pass. That’s the main issue a lot of people are facing.
The person you replied to has a lifetime-license, so no need for the clients to have a separate plan. Edit: Only thing where a separate license is needed afaik is the Download/Offline Watching feature. This will not work if a plex license owner adds a new User. Old/Existing Users can still use the download function. Here Plex made a change i think around 2 years ago.
Not if you’ve got a lifetime license, which anyone running a Plex server should already have.
Also if you want to give access to your jellyfin server to people, well you’re shit out of luck basically. You’re out of luck if you want to even watch jellyfin on most devices that aren’t a pc or android device.
But tailscale gets around that by creating a secure external tunnel that allows others to connect to your inside from anywhere in the world?
Tailscale isn’t on 99.99% of TVs and devices that people want to stream videos to, and asking people to connect to your VPN whenever they want to stream video is a no-go. Anyone suggesting it is has never actually done tech support for regular people.
Not quite, I’m a software engineer that was literally a support technician before this role and I’m the go-to tech support person for my friends. Most of the complexity is on the hosts end ~ https://tailscale.com/docs/features/tailscale-funnel
My opinion: Plex has made it clear that they want your money. They don’t want you to host your own media and be happy with that. They want you to pay a subscription.
The whole Plex Pass Lifetime subscription is kind of a trap. You might be getting away with paying once currently, but let’s be honest: That means that they have taken your money once. And a some time in the future, a MBA dude will notice that they have a lot of non-paying heavy users (meaning: users who have paid several years ago, which is not relevant for the revenue goals of the current quarter) - and they will try to get you to pay again and again. You might be okay with that, but if you don’t want to get hassled, you need to switch to something else.
I don’t understand this argument.
I paid once many years ago. I’ve never been asked to pay again. Why would I switch before they make a change?
In the meantime, jellyfin is getting better and better. Plex will probably be dead to me at some point, and when that happens, I’ll hop over.
Yeah, this is it. When they ask me for more money, or when they demand I host on their servers, I will adios. Until then, I paid $75 one time and the service does exactly what I want it to do, and it’s ezpz for a basic individual myself.
I think the most likely scenario is the company goes under because they didn’t have enough money, and then folks will come here and complain about that. Maybe I’ll be one of them, but I’ll try to remember I paid $75 more than 10 years ago, and so I think I’ve more than gotten my money’s worth.
Currently, they’ve been content to get more money out of you without asking you, so you’re right so far, but only if you consider your advertising details and personal information to be valueless.
They’re expanding data collection and showing more ads as a matter of course for years now. When they can no longer get money from other companies because of you, they’ll switch to nickel and diming you.
I find that it helps to think of transactions in a more reductive way, like bartering + money. I am trading X amount of money, Y amount if privacy, and Z amount of hassle for whatever service or product. Even though Y and Z are hard to quantify, they are real things with real value, so not considering them at all is surely worse for me, and what they’re counting on.
I have found that nearly every mainstream online service I might be interested in presents a negative value proposition when calculated like I described, but everyone values their privacy and time differently, so your mileage will, of course, vary.
Yeah, that’s really overthinking things. I host my movies and shows, I watch them from wherever. I feel like I’m not going to spend more time analyzing it, because my usage of the app is literally finding my movie and watching it, or putting it on for my kids. If my junk email gets more junk emails, so be it. I personally lost the privacy battle a million years ago, although I guess I do my best by not having Facebook or Instagram or anything of that ilk. I do exist, and so I’m fucked anyway, but I’m not going to spend energy that somehow doesn’t get me a meaningful return on that energy spent.
It may be applying more thought to it than you are willing to do, or be regarding things you don’t consider important or valuable, but very many people value those things and find them worthy of consideration.
To “overthink” something is to expend more time and energy making a decision than can be objectively gained from making the “best” decision vs. the others. Your decision to not consider the non-monetary costs is your own and your prerogative, but it has no bearing on the objective value of your personal privacy.
You’ve decided not to participate in the privacy battle and so have lost much of it without a fight, which is understandable. Its a hard, thankless battle without end against powerful foes, requiring vigilance and continually gaining knowledge. I think it is fair not to fault people for giving up, but passively encouraging others to give up, too, is working for the enemy you’ve surrendered to.
Its OK to let people choose their own priorities and pick their own battles, especially if it isn’t hurting anyone and entirely within their own lives like this issue is. People fighting for causes that you aren’t fighting for, but still benefit from, is a public good. Someone defending their own privacy is done for their own good, but helps you, too. See “do not track”, adblockers, the EFF, and countless other consumer protections as examples.
I appreciate you putting it this way. There IS a battle happening to be sure.
Unfortunately, it feels like the battle that’s being fought is between former Plex users and current (continuing) Plex users. It’s frustrating as a continuing Plex user to feel like we are making all of the Jellyfin users angry just by existing. Some of us feel like explaining why our choice is rational, but that is often met with more hostility.
My hope is that we all (as self-hosters) can recognize that we all have different priorities and those priorities will lead to different choices. It’s not wrong to leave Plex for something else. It’s also not wrong to keep using Plex if it suits your needs.
(to be clear, I’m not at all implying that you were being hostile. This is just a general impression I get from several self-hosting communities when it comes to Plex versus other options)
My sister refers to this phenomenon often; “making perfect the enemy of good”. I’d like to see the same things as you, though it seems that infighting among the like-minded must be a common human psychological trait. That would explain the tons of barely differentiated Catholic denominations and the hundreds of Linux distributions.
It helps me to think of it in terms of academic debate. We may vigorously disagree on sometimes trivial points, but we continue to all advance in the same direction in spite of those disagreements.
Plus you can easily run them side by side. I setup jellyfin a while back when Plex used to charge users for streaming on mobile but now they don’t if the server owner has a Plex pass.
For me Plex is still a lot simpler to manage if you have a lot of users, and if users have their own servers they share with you
I did that for a bit, but there was a noticeable increase in power usage on my server for something I’m not using.
Power usage? Both systems should be doing basically nothing unless they’re re-indexing - which is generally done on-demand. I can understand using up a bit of memory for the basic service and an imperceptible amount of CPU time, but why would it be using more power?
They became dead to me much sooner then you. Once they knew what I was watching I left.
Same brought mine almost 8 years ago, and have never had to pay them a cent more.
Overall not a bad investment.
And plex just looks nicer and offers a better experience.
If it changes I’ll consider migrating but for the moment Plex had done right by thier lifetime pass members
That hasn’t been my experience. They unilaterally changed their TOS repeatedly after I was already subscribed to a lifetime agreement. Even if they made the terms better, that’s still bogus, as contracts of adhesion are ethically dubious in general. This is economics, not Calvinball.
Charging for certain services is one thing. That’s not what drove the last Plex exosdus.
Most people take umbrage at Plex offering features for free, saying they’ll never be paid features, and then removing them as options for free accounts and effectively paywalling them.
That’s pretty much where I’m at too.
Both Jellyfin and Plex are pretty great currently, I prefer Plex slightly, but if Plex becomes worse then I’ll likely make the switch over to Jellyfin. I’ve liked Jellyfin for years but Plex has still been my main app.
I have both of them installed anyway.
Plex is less confusing to use if you want to share your library, but thankfully I don’t have any concerns about that because I’m selfish with my media and just have it set up for my own personal use.
*when Plex becomes worse
I am not aware of any company that has reversed course on enshittification once it has begun, so Plex seems certain to follow that path. I would consider at least being prepared.
That’s fair, I did use the wrong word there.
I am not aware of any company that has reversed course on enshittification once it has begun
It happens when they’re punished for it in the market. Microsoft finally realized they’re bleeding Windows and Xbox users, so they’ve got major initiatives to improve both. Unity tried to make the worst business pivot I’ve ever heard of, and their customers were very clearly and vocally jumping ship in response, so they undid that pivot. Plex’s only competition is an alternative that doesn’t have a business model, so if they bleed enough users to Jellyfin, they’ll either reverse course or stop just shy of some threshold where people leave Plex; or their business will die, which is also an option on the table.
Those are called “trial balloons”. They announce a feature they know will be wildly unpopular to gauge the severity of the backlash, then temporarily reverse course while running a massive public outreach campaign to draw as much attention as possible to their feel-good response to the public: “we hear you and respect your opinions”, etc.
Then, when the buzz dies down, they re-implement those same things slowly and quietly. In some of your examples, their responses are literally nothing more than words in print; no actual actions have been taken that align with their announcements.
Unity somewhat fits that description, but it was definitely net negative for their business, and with how long it took them to walk back from it, I don’t think they had any plans to walk back before the backlash. Microsoft has been slowly making Windows worse for a long, long time; it wasn’t something they did all at once and then issued a “we hear you”. They are legitimately scared of losing their market dominance right now.
I’ll reserve judgment on Microsoft’s motives until I see them take even a single action, not statement, in a positive direction. Right now, they seem to just be putting a fake moustache on Copilot, calling it something else, and then claiming they’re rolling back frivolous Copilot integrations.
This is exactly my strategy. My Lifetime Plex Pass paid for itself years ago. As soon as Jellyfin makes it easy to share my library with friends and family, I’ll move
I’m in this same boat. Right now jellyfin just isn’t close enough.
I was at a buddies house last week, he uses jellyfin. We were having weird decoding issues, pink/purple flashes that looked like HDMI desync.
Resetting/reseating etc etc anything on the TV did nothing. Had to restart his server then it was magically fine 🤔
I’m fine dealing with that kind of stuff occasionally, but my family is not capable.
I have paid for lifetime years ago and I’m still using it. They may introduce new features and try to entice me to pay for them, but so far no one is trying to cut me off from what I paid for
Isn’t that kinda exactly what the OP was saying with their comment about MBAs realising they have non-paying users?
I don’t run Plex so I don’t know, but from your comment it sounds like the Plex Pass isn’t “all past, present and future premium features”?
Or were you theorising about a future where they do ask you to pay more?
I’m not missing any features I got when I paid for it (I believe they’ve added some), so no complaints from me.
Just wait that “lifetime” package will end and they will say we need your money every month now, sooner rather than later.
I think I’ve already heard that a few years ago.
I’m reminded of a few things. Enpass giving away Pro subscriptions, then years later on adding a higher tier, Premium. Nova’s Prime will apparently become just one tier of many premium tiers for the app. Podcast Addict adding another subscription on top of the premium IAP.
This kind of shit happens all the time, and Plex could do it. Good thing I’m already with Jellyfin.
To me this means they know they don’t have a viable business model. It’s possible they took on a lot of debt years ago, and now they have to enshittify to pay it back. I paid for the lifetime membership years ago, and I would say I’ve more than gotten my money’s worth and I’m mostly still happy with Plex, but I would drop them in a heartbeat if jellyfin was a viable alternative.
People don’t like to admit it, but jellyfin doesn’t have feature parity yet. I think they could solve a lot of the issues if they went the federation route, but until then, it’s just easier for my family and friends to each have 1 plex account instead of N jellyfin accounts. Not to mention the jellyfin vulnerabilities that prevent me from considering hosting it openly.
People don’t like to admit it, but jellyfin doesn’t have feature parity yet. I think they could solve a lot of the issues if they went the federation route, but until then, it’s just easier for my family and friends to each have 1 plex account instead of N jellyfin accounts. Not to mention the jellyfin vulnerabilities that prevent me from considering hosting it openly
Could you maybe elaborate on the feature parity? What is missing? I also don’t get the info about N jellyfin accounts, as in separate jellyfin account per each different jellyfin server?
Why would you host it openly rather than in a VPN like Tailscale or whatever wire guard is?
Could you maybe elaborate on the feature parity?
- I travel often. There are a lot of devices in hotels, bnbs, and friend’s houses that have native plex support. Not so much for jellyfin.
- Casting to cast-compatible devices is very hit-or-miss, but mostly miss. I know the casting ecosystem is already a mess, but as far as user experience goes, Plex has spent more effort ironing it out.
- The native Plex client works with a controller on my bazzite HTPC when launched from the steam ui, while the native jellyfin client doesn’t.
I keep trying jellyfin out every few months, but so far keep hitting enough friction that I can’t reliably make the switch.
as in separate jellyfin account per each different jellyfin server?
Yes, if me and 5 of my friends have jellyfin servers, we all need accounts on each other’s servers. I then need to juggle accounts to access their content.
Jellyswarrm is a reverse proxy plugin I could run to mask the problem for myself, but it’s not a solution for mom who may have access to my server, and one other friend’s server that I don’t know.
The correct solution is federated accounts, but the devs have already stated that they don’t want to do that.
Why would you host it openly rather than in a VPN like Tailscale or whatever wire guard is?
Then friends and family have to be on my VPN to stream anything.
I went from paying SchedulesDirect $25/yr to hack an EPG into a series of dead & dying DVR software platforms (SageTV, WMC, etc)… To just doing the one-time Plex lifetime sub for $70ish.
It has more than paid for itself at this point… If they reneg an make it expensive someday in the future, maybe then I’ll reconsider Jellyfin.
They will release Plex-a-rama or Plex 2.0, stop providing security patches for 1.0, proxy routing, tmdb caching, epg caching, and add ads to your experience. They will then require the people connecting to you to have subs.
They were hoping to sell out and buy an island by now. Eventually, it will change hands or go public. Your features will be stripped as necessary to keep making money. Look at what happened to PlayOn’s lifetime subscription.
It’s already lasted WAY longer than anyone expected.
