• Guy Dudeman@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    The MDHS State Disbursement Unit is the Child Support department. Dude went nuts because he doesn’t want to pay child support. What a POS.

      • frickineh@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        Yeah they are. But fun fact, garnishments and liens work just as well without an INTERNATIONAL TREATY and a surprising number of these loons still work and own stuff.

        • Tar_Alcaran@sh.itjust.works
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          10 months ago

          Yes but they’re their own country, and the USA needs to form a treaty to have say in their business, unless they’re “travelling” or receiving welfare or benefit in some other way

      • starman2112@sh.itjust.works
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        10 months ago

        “I don’t have anything to do with that kid! Why should I have to pay child support?”

        Unfortunately I know people like that in real life, who don’t seem to understand that the child support is largely because they want nothing to do with their kid

        • aidan@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          What if before birth they prove that they wanted the child aborted?

          • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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            10 months ago

            If they are forced to be pregnant with it, that’s their choice.

            Have you ever spent nine months with a pregnant woman? They don’t do it because it’s fun.

              • KISSmyOS@feddit.de
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                10 months ago

                No, it should not. When two consenting adults have sex without protection, the resulting pregnancy shouldn’t be the sole problem of the woman.

                • aidan@lemmy.world
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                  10 months ago

                  She is the only one granted the choice to end the responsibility. The father is left with massive financial responsibility for 18 years, that the mother had the choice to prevent. This even occurs in cases of rape.

              • Timecircleline@sh.itjust.works
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                9 months ago

                Child support isn’t meant to punish a parent that’s no longer in the child’s life. Even if thats the end result, it’s meant to support the child.

                Because of the bodily autonomy argument there won’t be true equality surrounding pregnancy because nobody has (or should have) weight of decision of whether to carry the child except for the person who does so.

                But if a child is brought into the world as a result, it needs to be supported. And that’s the responsibility of the parents- willing or not.

                I think that if male birth control becomes safe and available it will be much closer to equality.

              • fkn@lemmy.world
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                10 months ago

                Your logic is fundamentally flawed. In several ways. I see several people arguing with you ineffectively because they assume you are arguing in good faith or have a coherent position… Neither of which I am convinced you possess.

                In the US (and most of the world) it is a fundamental right of bodily autonomy that any individual is not subjected to any forced medical situation in the support of another person’s life, regardless of that person’s age, gender or relationship with the other person. Even if we agreed on when personhood happens (I assume we disagree on it) at no point must one person give up their bodily rights for another. If you provide a special case for pregnancy then we are in a discussion of if your inconsistent belief structure is valid.

                • aidan@lemmy.world
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                  10 months ago

                  Your logic is fundamentally flawed. In several ways. I see several people arguing with you ineffectively because they assume you are arguing in good faith or have a coherent position…

                  You’re free to disagree with me, but everything I say on here is in good faith.

                  In the US (and most of the world) it is a fundamental right of bodily autonomy that any individual is not subjected to any forced medical situation in the support of another person’s life, regardless of that person’s age, gender or relationship with the other person.

                  Yep, I agree.

                  Even if we agreed on when personhood happens (I assume we disagree on it) at no point must one person give up their bodily rights for another.

                  I have no strong opinion on when personhood happens, I simply don’t know.

                  If you provide a special case for pregnancy then we are in a discussion of if your inconsistent belief structure is valid.

                  A special case for what? You never expressed your disagreement with me.

          • starman2112@sh.itjust.works
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            10 months ago

            If they were going to want the baby aborted, they shouldn’t have had sex without a condom. You don’t get to cum inside someone and then tell them what to do with it. Your jizz, your problem.

              • expr@programming.dev
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                10 months ago

                Obviously not. They’re saying that the person that gets pregnant gets to decide whether or not they want to abort. It’s not the decision of the sperm donor.

                • aidan@lemmy.world
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                  10 months ago

                  So, a mother has a choice to opt out of paying for a child if they can’t afford it. But a father is given the same choice.

              • starman2112@sh.itjust.works
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                10 months ago

                What a person does with their own body is entirely up to them. If you play your part in making that baby, and the person you came inside of plays their part too, you both have to pay for it. The sperm donor has one opportunity to opt out of being a parent, and that one opportunity is when they’re having sex.

                • aidan@lemmy.world
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                  10 months ago

                  What a person does with their own body is entirely up to them.

                  Yes, but when one person has the choice to not have a child, the other person can express their desire to not raise the child.

                  If you play your part in making that baby, and the person you came inside of plays their part too, you both have to pay for it.

                  Why?

                  The sperm donor has one opportunity to opt out of being a parent, and that one opportunity is when they’re having sex.

                  Why?

  • Lifecoach5000@lemmy.worldM
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    10 months ago

    “I DO NOT HAVE AN INTERNATIONAL TREATY WITH YOU” is about to be my go to line to get out of uncomfortable situations.

  • SuperDuper@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    I DO NOT KNOW WHO YOU ARE

    I DO NOT UNDERSTAND YOUR INTENT

    Bullshit. You know that mail is regarding the child support payments you’re trying to weasel your way out of.

        • Crack0n7uesday@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          If your serious, it’s something we do every few years to see how many people live in the US (like how many people live at your house), what race and gender you all are, income and that sort of thing. Basically it just gives the government a general idea of how many people live in the US, whether or not they are citizens and other social and economic shit. You fill them out anonymously and it only effects general population reports and stuff, it doesn’t really effect you personally. It’s pretty much only used for statistical purposes.

          I think the MDHS one is Mississippi child support and this “sovereign citizen” is a deadbeat parent (surprise).

        • expr@programming.dev
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          10 months ago

          Out of curiosity, does your country not have a census? I would have guessed every country does to have accurate information about their populace.

          • uis@lemmy.world
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            10 months ago

            In my hellscape there are three sources of information about who lives in country

            1. Registration in police
            • They also issue internal pasports
            • I think foreigners register there too
            • Their registration is used by election committees
            • Registration is based on place where you live(permanent for your home and temproary for stuff like hotel, camping site, prison…)
            1. ЗАГС
            • Civil registration?
            • They give birth and death certificates
            • They also keep track of citizenship
            • And marriages
            1. Census
            • They knock on doors and write whatever what said by people
            • They ask foreigners only 7 questions and 33 questions for citizens
            • If you say you are unicorn mare from Equestria they will write that here lives unicorn mare from Equestria
            • It is used to get factual information about what people live here
            • They don’t ask pasports or any other document

            Participating in census is not mandatory here. If you make census mandatory it will probably be no better than existing beaurocracy and defeats purpose of getting on-ground truth.

          • DampCanary@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            Sorry, yes it has every 10 years, it’s just english is not my native langusge and I never used(heard/saw) census so I was confused.

            • uis@lemmy.world
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              10 months ago

              How? Is it China? I can’t imagine real digitalized census without China level of surveillance.

              • limelight79@lemm.ee
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                10 months ago

                I, uh, happen to be an expert in censuses.

                The US of course tries to get everyone to respond, and sends people out to follow up with people who don’t respond, such as this sovereign citizen in the original post. (The picture is of the 2020 Census envelope and as such is ~4 years old, by the way.)

                Some European countries do an administrative records census, wherein they know who is in the country based on passport control, birth and death records, and so on. These censuses have the (admitted) flaw that someone who is in the country illegally would almost certainly not be counted, but on the flip side they are MUCH cheaper and faster than the US-style census. It’s basically just running an SQL query on the database.

                Other countries do a mix of the two. Even the US uses administrative records sometimes, if good data is available, and they can’t get a response another way.

                The US’s situation is more complex than many countries, because driver’s licenses (which serve as IDs) are issued by the individual states, not the federal government, and relatively few Americans ever get a passport. So, the closest things to a “master list” of people in the US that the government has are things like IRS and Social Security records - but those have flaws, too - for example, they don’t count legal visitors.

                I do not know what China et al do to complete their censuses.

                • uis@lemmy.world
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                  10 months ago

                  Copy-pasta from my another comment:

                  In my hellscape there are three main sources of information about who lives in country

                  1. Registration in police
                  • They also issue internal pasports
                  • I think foreigners register there too
                  • Their registration is used by election committees
                  • Registration is based on place where you live(permanent for your home and temproary for stuff like hotel, camping site, prison…)
                  1. ЗАГС
                  • Civil registration?
                  • They give birth and death certificates
                  • They also keep track of citizenship
                  • And marriages
                  1. Census
                  • They knock on doors and write whatever what said by people
                  • They ask foreigners only 7 questions and 33 questions for citizens
                  • If you say you are unicorn mare from Equestria they will write that here lives unicorn mare from Equestria
                  • It is used to get factual information about what people live here
                  • They don’t ask pasports or any other document

                  Participating in census is not mandatory here. If you make census mandatory it will probably be no better than existing beaurocracy and defeats purpose of getting on-ground truth.


                  I do not know what China et al do to complete their censuses.

                  I mean for govt to know how much each ring of hell is polulated and who in fact lives there instead of just registered needs either to knock on the door or spy on everyone. Not that I know what China does for their censuses.

  • arc@lemm.ee
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    10 months ago

    The best thing about sovereign citizens is they’re the only ones not in on the joke.

      • CheeseNoodle@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        Honestly their BS does kind of work they just seem unable to grasp that all the things they’re saying also apply to everyone else. They don’t have to aknowledge their electricity providers authority to charge them for electricity and the electric company doesn’t have to keep supplying it. Its like some kind of extreme narcisicm.

        • dual_sport_dork 🐧🗡️@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          'Cept in most locales you have to maintain your home’s “habitability status” to not get it condemned, which requires having a functional electrical supply. And usually also working plumbing, heat, some manner of cooking apparatus, and a refrigerator.

          “Muh Freedumb!” aside, these types of code requirements were as I understand it at least initially put into place to prevent slumlords from charging rent for an “apartment” that has access to none of the above.

          Anyhow, if you really don’t want to pay electric bills it’s really not too tough to get yourself some solar panels or something. Somehow that never occurs to these people. There are counties out in the boondocks where you are permitted by law to live fully off the grid if you feel like it, so maybe they ought to move there and quit bothering everybody with their nonsense.

          • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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            10 months ago

            I think water and sewage are required but I don’t think electricity is because a property is technically habitable without power. As long as there is not a vulnerable person confirmed living at the address. I mean it all seems a bit arbitrary, but apparently those are the rules.

            I think it’s mostly about making it unpleasant for squatters without violating their human rights too much. It straddles the line but not too badly.

            • dual_sport_dork 🐧🗡️@lemmy.world
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              10 months ago

              This is another one of them there varies by state/county/city things. Where I live you must be connected to the grid. This causes problems for people who don’t want to be connected to the grid, i.e. they have more than enough solar or windmill and battery capacity to not require it from a functional standpoint. But the county forbids you from not paying the local electricity monopoly their monthly bribe.

              This is relatively recent – as of the last 4 or 5 years or so. The power company now helpfully charges a “connection fee” if you use 0 kWh, which started happening exactly at the same time the law was passed to make it illegal not to be connected to them. I can’t help but conclude that these two facts are not coincidental.

              • zod000@lemmy.ml
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                10 months ago

                My previous area was like that, and that was why I didn’t bother getting a battery system for my solar. And the connection fee went up, and up, and up.

      • Mamertine@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        The appeal is there. Imagine not having to pay any taxes or any of your bills. The idea practically sells itself to anyone who has no civics education.

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      10 months ago

      If they don’t open it they can’t have read it and therefore aren’t bound by what’s in it. <- sovcit logic

      • KevonLooney@lemm.ee
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        10 months ago

        I mean, that does work. Unless the letter is sent certified mail, it’s not guaranteed to arrive. It could be lost on the way so they can’t prove you got it.

        Of course if you write all over it and post it online then you clearly got it.

  • Neato@ttrpg.network
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    10 months ago

    By and large, I think most of these people are just trying to get out of legal and financial obligations. I bet if a government agency sent them a check, they’d fucking cash it. But it’s when they’re required to pay money or complete the littlest forms that they balk. They are just bad scammers.

  • Empricorn@feddit.nl
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    10 months ago

    “Not a US citizen”

    Okay, so GTFO if you’re renouncing your citizenship. And don’t use any public roads or services as you’re leaving…

      • KISSmyOS@feddit.de
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        10 months ago

        Or make a treaty with an interested nation to deport them to.
        I’m guessing Russia and North Korea would be interested.

        • uis@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          Russia

          No. Idiots are on the other side of bath tub formerly known as ocean.

      • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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        10 months ago

        Yup, its an old Civil War era law for folks who tried to avoid dying in the Civil War by moving to Canada. Reasoning was, if you wanted to draft dodge you could support the war financially instead. Then during the early 2000s as folks who graduated college at the wrong time and ended up more college debt than they can ever pay off started moving abroad to escape it, they increased the fee and took other steps to make renouncing more difficult since expats were renouncing their citizenship to stop owing taxes in the US

        • uis@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          ended up more college debt than they can ever pay off started moving abroad to escape it, they increased the fee

          Short version: USA wanted slaves

          to stop owing taxes in the US

          I’m not a lawyer and I’m not from US, but I’m pretty sure this is not how it works.

          • qwrty@lemmy.world
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            10 months ago

            I’m not a lawyer and I’m not from US, but I’m pretty sure this is not how it works.

            Ah but it is. The US is, as far as I know, the only country who taxes its citizens who are living abroad. And yes, it is as stupid and shitty as it sounds.

            • uis@lemmy.world
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              10 months ago

              No, I mean stopping owing part. If you did not pay taxes but should have while you were citizen, you are still owe taxes.

              It seems US is most backwards country. Well, it could be most upside-down country, but this title is already claimed by Australia.

              • Trainguyrom@reddthat.com
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                10 months ago

                Perhaps I could have worded it better. I meant not accruing additional taxes to pay. But if you’re already debt dodging by changing countries, realistically what is the federal government gonna do?

  • NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone
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    10 months ago

    If these people are not citizens of any country, they’d have to be deported to International Waters for not holding a visa right?

      • AlexisFR
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        10 months ago

        Well the ocean doesn’t discriminate.

        • scoobford@lemmy.zip
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          10 months ago

          Stateless people (not this whacko) are often stateless through no fault of their own. Shifting borders, oversight in government policy, or legal discrimination have deprived them of the rights and privileges they are entitled to.

          Pretty much wherever they go, they have a hard time getting ID, enrolling in school, finding legal housing or work, etc.

          • KevonLooney@lemm.ee
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            10 months ago

            About 100K Armenians were just made stateless and kicked out of Azerbaijan recently. You didn’t hear about it because of Israel and no one cares about Azerbaijan.

            These were people who predated the Soviet Union, became part of the Soviet Union, outlasted the Soviet Union, and then wanted their own country. They were living on land claimed by Azerbaijan but they understandably thought “That’s a made up country. They just made it up. We can make up our own country.”

            Unfortunately, “living somewhere for a hundred years” doesn’t count for much today. So Azeris kicked them out of their homes and they had to leave to Armenia. Azerbaijan is now eyeing Armenian territory and these people have to apply for Armenian citizenship, through no real fault of their own.

  • unreasonabro@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    That motherfucker must feel so powerful writing that… stuff.

    I mean the only other kick he’s going to get is to the teeth by the feds, so I hope he’s getting something out of it.

  • AeonFelis@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Is this the kind of people who post disclaimers in social media that “unauthorize” the company running said social media from using the “content” they post there?

  • LEDZeppelin@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Should these “sovereign citizens” be arrested and put in illegal migrant camps the minute they set foot on public roads, or should we reserve that VIP treatment only for brown Spanish-speaking people?

  • pensivepangolin@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Sovereign citizens are some of the stupidest dregs of society. It doesn’t even take proper legal training to realize how wrong and how stupid their statements are when they do this kind of garbage.

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      10 months ago

      It requires such a weird pick and choose approach to the law to make these arguments and it just baffles me. Like who do they even expect to back them?

  • edgemaster72@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    “Not a U.S. citizen”

    Throw this ass clown out into international waters like they’re DJ Jazzy Jeff overstaying his welcome