Extreme left-leaning means they agree with Marx that Capitalism is a doomed system, and work towards its dismantling. If they don’t agree with that goal… they aren’t far left.
It’s so frustrating when people think left means BLM and LGBTQIA+ and vaccination. Those things are all great and I support them, but that’s not what makes me left: left is about Unions and social safety nets and community welfare and workers seizing the means of production.
I’m Left because my guiding principle for how countries should be managed is “The greatest good for the greatest number”.
This puts me in a collision course often with “lefties” who are just tribalists mindlessly parroting slogans and cheering for celebrities of “their side”, because they never validate what they hear from “their side” against any such principles, which is how you end up with “lefties” such as tankies or the kind of “feminist” who just happens to be a high middle class woman who thinks “breaking the glass ceiling in corporate management” is far more important than reducing the 40,000% wage difference between CEOs and the average employee, in other words putting “loyalty to the team” far above and beyond doing what’s best for society as a whole or simply trying to further their personal greed objectives using the some “group identity” as cover.
Those not capable of putting personal upside maximization or petty emotional needs (including all those related to tribalism) to the side if that is required for the greater good, are not leftwing, IMHO.
Being against discriminating people based on gender or orientation is being against hierarchies that put women or LGBT at the bottom; being against exploitation or favoring unions is about improving the situation of people who are below in a currently existing hierarchy. If you want absolute gender and LGBT equality but wholeheartedly support the right of Boeing’s shareholders to gain lots of money and not to get taxed too much, you have some leftist ideas and some right-wing ideas. If you want to establish absolute socialism but think gay people especifically shouldn’t kiss in public, you have some leftist ideas and some right-wing ideas, because you’re putting gay people at the bottom of hierarchy.
In the US, worker rights and social participation in the economy often gets left out of “what it is the left” because of the Cold War persecution against anticapitalist ideals and the predominance of the Democratic Party’s old guard at establishing discourse, which creates a skewed vision.
I’m left by default because I don’t support violent coups, and I don’t particularly care what some people choose to do with their genitals. Pretty pathetic when I put it that way, but that’s just how it is…
Before then? It stood for general democratic desire and the idea that people should have the power over government rather than the old establishments. And before that… the concept of left and right didn’t exist. Since they came up during the French Revolution when the revolutionary members sat on the left side of the assembly in Versailles, opposite the supporters of the old regime on the right side.
Like… are you talking about ideological drift? In that case, all political forces have moved towards the right since the 80s. Most prominent in the US, where our “left” party is actually center right
I’m really not trying to dunk on you when I say this: you’ve fundamentally misunderstood the left-right political theory. A previously left-wing party can drift to the right and vice versa. A party called the “lefty left socialist communist hippy party” can be made up completely of right-wingers, and that doesn’t change the definition of left and right. I won’t try and explain the definitions of political left and right to you because there are almost definitely better explanations out there than I could give. I just implore you to find an impartial, unbiased explainer.
GHWB was pretty solid IMO. Unfairly got voted out for the whole ‘read my lips’ thing. Check out this speech at the UN Panel on Climate Change. He is coherent, dignified, rational, and reasonable. So you know, unelectable by today’s GOP, but we’ve known that for a while…
…and I’m saying GHWB wasn’t that bad IMO. The last reasonable republican of that generation. Somehow that’s a controversial thing to say though apparently 🙄
Im a left leaning landlord and im not like that at all.
Im fixing everything thats needed and improving stuff from time to time but basically staying out of their lives.
I wasn’t saying psycho left is common or that you’re like that, just that they exist. It’s harder to spot them because there seems to be so very many psycho right nuts lately.
Or at least if someone actually held to their principles, they would not remain both for very long .
(The concept of a separate ownership class, which is the defining feature of landlordism, is in direct contradiction with leftism, which at the furthest end pushes for the destruction of these sorts of hierarchical class systems, or at the very least attempts to abolish the gatekeeping and hoarding of base necessities like shelter)
Only some, usually the very right leaning ones or the very left leaning ones. Normal people behave normally.
I can assure you the very left leaning ones don’t. If they did, they wouldn’t be left leaning.
That was true a few years ago. Republicans were the good guys once too, but they sure as shit aren’t today. Things change.
Extreme left-leaning means they agree with Marx that Capitalism is a doomed system, and work towards its dismantling. If they don’t agree with that goal… they aren’t far left.
It’s so frustrating when people think left means BLM and LGBTQIA+ and vaccination. Those things are all great and I support them, but that’s not what makes me left: left is about Unions and social safety nets and community welfare and workers seizing the means of production.
I’m Left because my guiding principle for how countries should be managed is “The greatest good for the greatest number”.
This puts me in a collision course often with “lefties” who are just tribalists mindlessly parroting slogans and cheering for celebrities of “their side”, because they never validate what they hear from “their side” against any such principles, which is how you end up with “lefties” such as tankies or the kind of “feminist” who just happens to be a high middle class woman who thinks “breaking the glass ceiling in corporate management” is far more important than reducing the 40,000% wage difference between CEOs and the average employee, in other words putting “loyalty to the team” far above and beyond doing what’s best for society as a whole or simply trying to further their personal greed objectives using the some “group identity” as cover.
Those not capable of putting personal upside maximization or petty emotional needs (including all those related to tribalism) to the side if that is required for the greater good, are not leftwing, IMHO.
Left is about how you feel regarding hierarchies.
Being against discriminating people based on gender or orientation is being against hierarchies that put women or LGBT at the bottom; being against exploitation or favoring unions is about improving the situation of people who are below in a currently existing hierarchy. If you want absolute gender and LGBT equality but wholeheartedly support the right of Boeing’s shareholders to gain lots of money and not to get taxed too much, you have some leftist ideas and some right-wing ideas. If you want to establish absolute socialism but think gay people especifically shouldn’t kiss in public, you have some leftist ideas and some right-wing ideas, because you’re putting gay people at the bottom of hierarchy.
In the US, worker rights and social participation in the economy often gets left out of “what it is the left” because of the Cold War persecution against anticapitalist ideals and the predominance of the Democratic Party’s old guard at establishing discourse, which creates a skewed vision.
I’m left by default because I don’t support violent coups, and I don’t particularly care what some people choose to do with their genitals. Pretty pathetic when I put it that way, but that’s just how it is…
What did it mean before then?
As I said, things change.
Before then? It stood for general democratic desire and the idea that people should have the power over government rather than the old establishments. And before that… the concept of left and right didn’t exist. Since they came up during the French Revolution when the revolutionary members sat on the left side of the assembly in Versailles, opposite the supporters of the old regime on the right side.
Like… are you talking about ideological drift? In that case, all political forces have moved towards the right since the 80s. Most prominent in the US, where our “left” party is actually center right
I’m really not trying to dunk on you when I say this: you’ve fundamentally misunderstood the left-right political theory. A previously left-wing party can drift to the right and vice versa. A party called the “lefty left socialist communist hippy party” can be made up completely of right-wingers, and that doesn’t change the definition of left and right. I won’t try and explain the definitions of political left and right to you because there are almost definitely better explanations out there than I could give. I just implore you to find an impartial, unbiased explainer.
When was that, 160 years ago?
GHWB was pretty solid IMO. Unfairly got voted out for the whole ‘read my lips’ thing. Check out this speech at the UN Panel on Climate Change. He is coherent, dignified, rational, and reasonable. So you know, unelectable by today’s GOP, but we’ve known that for a while…
https://www.c-span.org/video/?11033-1/presidential-address
I was referring to Lincoln.
…and I’m saying GHWB wasn’t that bad IMO. The last reasonable republican of that generation. Somehow that’s a controversial thing to say though apparently 🙄
Im a left leaning landlord and im not like that at all. Im fixing everything thats needed and improving stuff from time to time but basically staying out of their lives.
Good guy landlord.
I wasn’t saying psycho left is common or that you’re like that, just that they exist. It’s harder to spot them because there seems to be so very many psycho right nuts lately.
“Left leaning landlord” is an oxymoron ;p
Or at least if someone actually held to their principles, they would not remain both for very long .
(The concept of a separate ownership class, which is the defining feature of landlordism, is in direct contradiction with leftism, which at the furthest end pushes for the destruction of these sorts of hierarchical class systems, or at the very least attempts to abolish the gatekeeping and hoarding of base necessities like shelter)
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4 liberals so far are mad at reality