When exactly was that “real civilization”? When people were being arranged into marriages? Or when people would put ads into newspapers to find love? Or when dating shows started on TV? The next step after TV was pretty much Tinder. We have never been above using “creepy and stupid” options.
I don’t get the hate dating apps get. It’s a tool like every other, it helps you meet people outside of your regular circle. It’s not ideal because it’s next to impossible to everything you are into a short profile but it’s better than the solutions we came up before. The issue is that people don’t know how to use Tinder. Most people have no idea what their profile should look like, they put too much importance on any kind of a match and then they try too hard to get anywhere. Tinder match is the real world equivalent of locking your eyes someone on the street or a bar or a cafe or whatever. Just because that happened doesn’t mean anything more will happen. You don’t run after everyone who looks at you begging them to date you. So why do that on Tinder?
Millenial here. Never used online dating. Never used arranged marriages. Never used newspapers.
Dated a bunch. Just met and befriended a lot of people through shared areas of interest. Indoor soccer mixed league / gardening group / dog park / dog events at a local shop.
I also wasn’t creepy and bothered people with trying to get a relationship from these events. Just a chatty comical person. And with regular attendance - bumped into similar people over time and eventually did more personal shit with them and felt out why.
Online dating sort of (to me) turns the act of dating into a hobby or even a profession? and then people land these relationships where they expect something out of the other person. “You need a perfect resume with good line spacing and indentation, if you want connection!”
When I just pursued my hobbies and enjoyment areas and bumped into people who mutually enjoyed those things and would just talk about those things. Like at most seek connection to the things you love and do them with people you like. And then build on those connections. That’s what people really want when they log into profiles.
Note I don’t have any social media other than Lemmy. Haha.
I didn’t say dating doesn’t work. I also dated a bunch from my regular circle but eventually decided to switch to Tinder because I didn’t want intimate relations ruining my friends groups. Or at the very least I didn’t want to be the whose intimate relations would ruin friendships. That was my reason to go to Tinder.
And with my experience on Tinder what I did say was that Tinder is not some creepy or stupid way to go about dating. You don’t need to turn it into some kind a hobby or a profession. You don’t need to start a relationship (in it’s most general meaning) with some kind of expectations of intimacy or whatever. You don’t need a perfectly made profile. Those are the assumptions people have when they don’t understand Tinder. It’s a tool to meet people outside of your regular circle. You’re building this tool and the followup date to be bigger than it needs to be and of course it’s going to look creepy and stupid, you’re making it creepy and stupid. Here’s how I used Tinder.
I put minimum effort into swiping. I didn’t spend any time analyzing some images or bios or anything like that, if there was anything that remotely piqued my interest I would swipe right. If there was a match then texting was pretty much a vibe check, because at that point there was still nothing tangible and thus also no reason to put in a lot of effort. If they’re cool I would offer to go out, have a coffee or a walk in the park or anything neutral that still gives us the space to have a chat and figure out who we’re really meeting. A meeting is still not a commitment so I didn’t treat is as such. If they ghosted they ghosted and I’d just do something else. When we actually met I didn’t treat them like some kind of a checklist of my expectations for them. In fact I had no expectations for them. I had am idea of who I’m looking for but I’d also have to match who they’re looking for to actually have a match between us, so no reason to expect anything at that point. And the date would be just chatting and learning who they are and I made a lot of friends that way because there wasn’t anything romantic there but they were cool people.
I don’t think there’s anything particularly creepy or stupid about that. The first part seems creepy but that’s just how the tool works. If someone gave you a list of random 100 people and told you to figure out how who you’d want to meet you’d probably do the exact same thing because going in-depth with 100 people before you’ve even met them is creepy as nobody would (nor should) put in that much effort.
Yeah I will say I was lucky in my mid twenties in what was available to access around me / my town. I’m now 35 and other than a dog shop that has events where I meet a bunch of people with dogs - I don’t have a lot of the same overlaps but am happily married so it wasn’t the goal on where to settle (more what school do we want etc.)
I’m just outside of the NYC area and so can find some weird unique thing with a quick train ride attached.
If you play sports and enjoy training 5k-10k-half marathon groups are a great add to meet like minded people that may have a more favorable split haha. Doesn’t hurt to get the cardio up. But again I would ask - what other interests do you have that are unexplored - that could be interesting to chase. It will be super uncomfortable to take a stab at it. But it’s a win if you do it. A win win if you meet folks while doing it.
Yes, literally those are our only options here, dark-ages arranged slavery or “The Love Connection” or dating apps everyone (but you!) hate with a passion. That’s really spot-on. Perfect, exactly the smart, nuanced responses I’m always delighted to have to interact with.
The “people don’t know how to use Tinder” is fine, great, fucking whatever. In the end all you’re doing is trying to replicate the way people have been meeting and getting to know each other for eons. If it works for you, FINE GO USE IT. I’m obviously not talking to the minority who enjoy the effort of trying to replicate natural human behavior on a glowing screen.
I’m very obviously talking to the people it doesn’t work for or who have the same problems online as they do in real life. The huge fucking difference here is with dating apps, when you’re done swiping that’s it, you don’t learn anything, you don’t figure out how to be a better conversation partner, you don’t self-reflect in any healthy way and that’s how most people use it. It’s gestures into the darkness.
I’m sorry. I forgot I’m talking to a big alpha male who can only express themselves in an aggressive tone. My bad. And I’m sure your advice of “Just get over yourself and get out there you fucking pussy” is unbelievably useful to all those people who struggle to date. They definitely couldn’t have come up with that on their own. And of course fuck online dating because big stonk alpha no likey thing they no understand.
Buy a Delorean, find doc Brown and flux capacitor yourself back to the 80s where you belong.
I’m sorry I intimidated you with my text on a screen and made you think I’m big and scary because I used harsh language.
And sorry, to those struggling with socializing, there’s no shortcut. If you are that bad off, go get therapy, it works wonders. Otherwise, we all struggled at some point before we started learning it’s okay to be yourself even if it causes you to intimidate people on the internet.
Reminder: the internet didn’t always exist, people got along just fine. People have always struggled with socializing and then forcing themselves to get through their obstacles. The modern internet age disincentivizes you from going out and being a more social person who keeps learning. There are millions of kids out there giving up on life because they embarrassed themselves ONE time with someone, then got all kinds of support from other shut-ins. Many people do this on some level and that’s what we should be pushing against, even if it hurts some people’s feelings.
You being unnecessarily aggressive does not intimidate me. I simply didn’t appreciate the tone because when you act that way all you’re showing is that you can’t have a civil discussion.
And I agree that there are no shortcuts to socializing. But this “go out there and date” advice isn’t going to help anyone. It’s like telling someone living their car “just build a house”. It does nothing in regards to helping them figure out how to do that.
And I’m not sure what you’re even complaining about regarding dating apps. The date isn’t happening in the app. In the end they still have to go out there and date, the dating app simply helps them get to that step. The dating app replaces only the “asking someone out” step, not the actual date itself. It takes a small step out of the whole dating process and you’re acting like that’s the entire problem. At the end of the day it doesn’t really matter if you physically asked someone out or if you matched on Tinder and asked them out, because when it comes to the actual date you still have to put yourself out there. Unless the online dating has warped into something completely different within the last 10 years they still need to learn how to have a conversation, how to pick up cues and find the confidence to make a move. The only thing online dating changes is that people don’t need to take a rejection straight to their face and get embarrassed into never trying again.
The dating app replaces only the “asking someone out” step, not the actual date itself.
I want to nitpick on this, because I’m told a lot of people use these apps, match, and then never actually ask the other person out. They then are sometimes puzzled why they’re not going on dates.
The only thing online dating changes is that people don’t need to take a rejection straight to their face and get embarrassed into never trying again.
It also helps filter out “oh, she doesn’t date men”, “wow, he’s anti-vax”, “he doesn’t want kids, ever, and i do” kind of stuff. At least, when the app is working and not fully enshittified. That stuff is valuable.
I want to nitpick on this, because I’m told a lot of people use these apps, match, and then never actually ask the other person out. They then are sometimes puzzled why they’re not going on dates.
I’m not sure if you’re implying they’re the same person, as in they won’t ask anyone out and then wonder why nobody goes out with them? Because that I can’t really explain. I guess maybe they’re shy or they think the other person should be asking them out, but if you’re going to leave it solely to chance then you have to accept that there’s a chance you never get asked out. But if someone is thinks they’re trying but it just doesn’t happen, then that needs a more deeper dive into why it wouldn’t happen. From my experience most of the time the people I didn’t go out with were people who were closed off, so my most general advice in that case would be to try to be more open. Nobody wants to pry answers out of you. Talk about yourself, or if you don’t like talking about yourself be more proactive in getting to know the other person. Be interested in them and let them be interested in you.
It also helps filter out “oh, she doesn’t date men”, “wow, he’s anti-vax”, “he doesn’t want kids, ever, and i do” kind of stuff. At least, when the app is working and not fully enshittified. That stuff is valuable.
That as well. Some people put in their bios clear no-nos and I think that’s great.
I’m not sure if you’re implying they’re the same person, as in they won’t ask anyone out and then wonder why nobody goes out with them? Because that I can’t really explain
Yes indeed. There was a guy I was talking to a while ago who said he never got any dates from the apps. I wanted to be helpful, so I asked him to describe his process and what happened.
He said he’d match (good), and then send them a nice personal message (great), they’d chat on the app (good) for a couple weeks (what) and then they’d stop responding.
He never asked them out but he’d keep talking to them, and seemed confused why he wasn’t having dates. I’m not exactly sure why- maybe he was waiting for the perfect moment that never came. I think this is somewhat common because I’ve seen a lot of profiles that say “not looking for a pen pal. Ask me out!”
I told the specific guy I was talking to I recommend asking people out after like one exchange and you’ve cleared your dealbreakers, and I hope that helped him.
my most general advice in that case would be to try to be more open. Nobody wants to pry answers out of you.
This is good advice. A very common blunder I see is people dead-ending conversations. Like someone will be like “oh my gosh I love your spaceslug T-shirt. Did you ever see them play live?” and they respond with “no [end of message]”. Like, what. How is the other person supposed to interpret that?
If it was in person I’d be like “oh ok this person doesn’t want to talk” but on an app, after we matched? Why respond at all? Just unmatch if you’re not interested, or respond later when you can whole-ass the response.
When exactly was that “real civilization”? When people were being arranged into marriages? Or when people would put ads into newspapers to find love? Or when dating shows started on TV? The next step after TV was pretty much Tinder. We have never been above using “creepy and stupid” options.
I don’t get the hate dating apps get. It’s a tool like every other, it helps you meet people outside of your regular circle. It’s not ideal because it’s next to impossible to everything you are into a short profile but it’s better than the solutions we came up before. The issue is that people don’t know how to use Tinder. Most people have no idea what their profile should look like, they put too much importance on any kind of a match and then they try too hard to get anywhere. Tinder match is the real world equivalent of locking your eyes someone on the street or a bar or a cafe or whatever. Just because that happened doesn’t mean anything more will happen. You don’t run after everyone who looks at you begging them to date you. So why do that on Tinder?
Millenial here. Never used online dating. Never used arranged marriages. Never used newspapers.
Dated a bunch. Just met and befriended a lot of people through shared areas of interest. Indoor soccer mixed league / gardening group / dog park / dog events at a local shop.
I also wasn’t creepy and bothered people with trying to get a relationship from these events. Just a chatty comical person. And with regular attendance - bumped into similar people over time and eventually did more personal shit with them and felt out why.
Online dating sort of (to me) turns the act of dating into a hobby or even a profession? and then people land these relationships where they expect something out of the other person. “You need a perfect resume with good line spacing and indentation, if you want connection!”
When I just pursued my hobbies and enjoyment areas and bumped into people who mutually enjoyed those things and would just talk about those things. Like at most seek connection to the things you love and do them with people you like. And then build on those connections. That’s what people really want when they log into profiles.
Note I don’t have any social media other than Lemmy. Haha.
I didn’t say dating doesn’t work. I also dated a bunch from my regular circle but eventually decided to switch to Tinder because I didn’t want intimate relations ruining my friends groups. Or at the very least I didn’t want to be the whose intimate relations would ruin friendships. That was my reason to go to Tinder.
And with my experience on Tinder what I did say was that Tinder is not some creepy or stupid way to go about dating. You don’t need to turn it into some kind a hobby or a profession. You don’t need to start a relationship (in it’s most general meaning) with some kind of expectations of intimacy or whatever. You don’t need a perfectly made profile. Those are the assumptions people have when they don’t understand Tinder. It’s a tool to meet people outside of your regular circle. You’re building this tool and the followup date to be bigger than it needs to be and of course it’s going to look creepy and stupid, you’re making it creepy and stupid. Here’s how I used Tinder.
I put minimum effort into swiping. I didn’t spend any time analyzing some images or bios or anything like that, if there was anything that remotely piqued my interest I would swipe right. If there was a match then texting was pretty much a vibe check, because at that point there was still nothing tangible and thus also no reason to put in a lot of effort. If they’re cool I would offer to go out, have a coffee or a walk in the park or anything neutral that still gives us the space to have a chat and figure out who we’re really meeting. A meeting is still not a commitment so I didn’t treat is as such. If they ghosted they ghosted and I’d just do something else. When we actually met I didn’t treat them like some kind of a checklist of my expectations for them. In fact I had no expectations for them. I had am idea of who I’m looking for but I’d also have to match who they’re looking for to actually have a match between us, so no reason to expect anything at that point. And the date would be just chatting and learning who they are and I made a lot of friends that way because there wasn’t anything romantic there but they were cool people.
I don’t think there’s anything particularly creepy or stupid about that. The first part seems creepy but that’s just how the tool works. If someone gave you a list of random 100 people and told you to figure out how who you’d want to meet you’d probably do the exact same thing because going in-depth with 100 people before you’ve even met them is creepy as nobody would (nor should) put in that much effort.
Ha my friend group got blown up recently from exactly the situation you described. Sucks.
The problem I have, is both my work and hobbies/sports are very male dominated, so there’s just not that many opportunities to meet someone.
Yeah I will say I was lucky in my mid twenties in what was available to access around me / my town. I’m now 35 and other than a dog shop that has events where I meet a bunch of people with dogs - I don’t have a lot of the same overlaps but am happily married so it wasn’t the goal on where to settle (more what school do we want etc.)
I’m just outside of the NYC area and so can find some weird unique thing with a quick train ride attached.
If you play sports and enjoy training 5k-10k-half marathon groups are a great add to meet like minded people that may have a more favorable split haha. Doesn’t hurt to get the cardio up. But again I would ask - what other interests do you have that are unexplored - that could be interesting to chase. It will be super uncomfortable to take a stab at it. But it’s a win if you do it. A win win if you meet folks while doing it.
Yes, literally those are our only options here, dark-ages arranged slavery or “The Love Connection” or dating apps everyone (but you!) hate with a passion. That’s really spot-on. Perfect, exactly the smart, nuanced responses I’m always delighted to have to interact with.
The “people don’t know how to use Tinder” is fine, great, fucking whatever. In the end all you’re doing is trying to replicate the way people have been meeting and getting to know each other for eons. If it works for you, FINE GO USE IT. I’m obviously not talking to the minority who enjoy the effort of trying to replicate natural human behavior on a glowing screen.
I’m very obviously talking to the people it doesn’t work for or who have the same problems online as they do in real life. The huge fucking difference here is with dating apps, when you’re done swiping that’s it, you don’t learn anything, you don’t figure out how to be a better conversation partner, you don’t self-reflect in any healthy way and that’s how most people use it. It’s gestures into the darkness.
I’m sorry. I forgot I’m talking to a big alpha male who can only express themselves in an aggressive tone. My bad. And I’m sure your advice of “Just get over yourself and get out there you fucking pussy” is unbelievably useful to all those people who struggle to date. They definitely couldn’t have come up with that on their own. And of course fuck online dating because big stonk alpha no likey thing they no understand.
Buy a Delorean, find doc Brown and flux capacitor yourself back to the 80s where you belong.
I’m sorry I intimidated you with my text on a screen and made you think I’m big and scary because I used harsh language.
And sorry, to those struggling with socializing, there’s no shortcut. If you are that bad off, go get therapy, it works wonders. Otherwise, we all struggled at some point before we started learning it’s okay to be yourself even if it causes you to intimidate people on the internet.
Reminder: the internet didn’t always exist, people got along just fine. People have always struggled with socializing and then forcing themselves to get through their obstacles. The modern internet age disincentivizes you from going out and being a more social person who keeps learning. There are millions of kids out there giving up on life because they embarrassed themselves ONE time with someone, then got all kinds of support from other shut-ins. Many people do this on some level and that’s what we should be pushing against, even if it hurts some people’s feelings.
You being unnecessarily aggressive does not intimidate me. I simply didn’t appreciate the tone because when you act that way all you’re showing is that you can’t have a civil discussion.
And I agree that there are no shortcuts to socializing. But this “go out there and date” advice isn’t going to help anyone. It’s like telling someone living their car “just build a house”. It does nothing in regards to helping them figure out how to do that.
And I’m not sure what you’re even complaining about regarding dating apps. The date isn’t happening in the app. In the end they still have to go out there and date, the dating app simply helps them get to that step. The dating app replaces only the “asking someone out” step, not the actual date itself. It takes a small step out of the whole dating process and you’re acting like that’s the entire problem. At the end of the day it doesn’t really matter if you physically asked someone out or if you matched on Tinder and asked them out, because when it comes to the actual date you still have to put yourself out there. Unless the online dating has warped into something completely different within the last 10 years they still need to learn how to have a conversation, how to pick up cues and find the confidence to make a move. The only thing online dating changes is that people don’t need to take a rejection straight to their face and get embarrassed into never trying again.
I want to nitpick on this, because I’m told a lot of people use these apps, match, and then never actually ask the other person out. They then are sometimes puzzled why they’re not going on dates.
It also helps filter out “oh, she doesn’t date men”, “wow, he’s anti-vax”, “he doesn’t want kids, ever, and i do” kind of stuff. At least, when the app is working and not fully enshittified. That stuff is valuable.
Sorry for the nitpicks. Good post though, thanks.
I’m not sure if you’re implying they’re the same person, as in they won’t ask anyone out and then wonder why nobody goes out with them? Because that I can’t really explain. I guess maybe they’re shy or they think the other person should be asking them out, but if you’re going to leave it solely to chance then you have to accept that there’s a chance you never get asked out. But if someone is thinks they’re trying but it just doesn’t happen, then that needs a more deeper dive into why it wouldn’t happen. From my experience most of the time the people I didn’t go out with were people who were closed off, so my most general advice in that case would be to try to be more open. Nobody wants to pry answers out of you. Talk about yourself, or if you don’t like talking about yourself be more proactive in getting to know the other person. Be interested in them and let them be interested in you.
That as well. Some people put in their bios clear no-nos and I think that’s great.
Yes indeed. There was a guy I was talking to a while ago who said he never got any dates from the apps. I wanted to be helpful, so I asked him to describe his process and what happened.
He said he’d match (good), and then send them a nice personal message (great), they’d chat on the app (good) for a couple weeks (what) and then they’d stop responding.
He never asked them out but he’d keep talking to them, and seemed confused why he wasn’t having dates. I’m not exactly sure why- maybe he was waiting for the perfect moment that never came. I think this is somewhat common because I’ve seen a lot of profiles that say “not looking for a pen pal. Ask me out!”
I told the specific guy I was talking to I recommend asking people out after like one exchange and you’ve cleared your dealbreakers, and I hope that helped him.
This is good advice. A very common blunder I see is people dead-ending conversations. Like someone will be like “oh my gosh I love your spaceslug T-shirt. Did you ever see them play live?” and they respond with “no [end of message]”. Like, what. How is the other person supposed to interpret that?
If it was in person I’d be like “oh ok this person doesn’t want to talk” but on an app, after we matched? Why respond at all? Just unmatch if you’re not interested, or respond later when you can whole-ass the response.