We all know the hypocrisies of the pro- Israel stances, I’m not going into specific arguments but it’s just everywhere. Normal people seem to have bought in even quicker than they did with supporting Ukraine. it’s awful. Free Palestine.

  • GeorgeZBush [he/him]@hexbear.net
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    131
    ·
    1 year ago

    For those of you who were around for it - this is how it felt to be a leftist or even just a sane person during 9/11, right? Just watching everyone around you and in the media become consumed with psychotic bloodlust?

    • beef_curds [she/her]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      70
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      This is exactly how I’ve been describing this moment. I haven’t been so lost in the world since that time. It feels like you can’t even begin to dig through the hate and propaganda. Everyone around you is acting morally superior for wanting blood. People you thought were a little more level headed are just consumed.

      It’s deeply upsetting to be watching this play out again. It feels like living inside a trainwreck and you don’t know how to help anything because it’s already happening with so much momentum.

      It also leaves you feeling deeply vulnerable. Like any day the world could pick you as a target, and everyone around you would cheer on as the world devoured you.

      I’ve thought so much on post 9/11, especially the run up to the Iraq War. I hoped I’d never feel this way again, but here we are.

      Take care of yourselves. Dunno what else to say.

      • iByteABit [he/him]@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        14
        ·
        1 year ago

        History never ends, eventually I believe and hope that people will look back at us in wonder of our stupidity, and the few of the few of us that get to be remembered in history will be finally recognised as beyond their time, just like we think of the Greek philosophers today.

        Take care and keep a glimpse of hope, it’s all we’ve got

    • neo [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      49
      ·
      1 year ago

      I have seen more pro-Palestinian and anti-apartheid stuff than I thought I would. Obviously not from the usual shitheads like at the WSJ or NYT but just in online comments around spaces. Obviously the western news narrative is pro-apartheid so that part is very usual. The side commentary is not.

      • mar_k [he/him]@hexbear.net
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        23
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        yeah it’s a tossup when it comes to liberals, and young people especially (i go to uni) seem to be mostly leaning pro-palestine. also, my older relatives/friends of relatives were both-sidesing it (seeing a lot of that), but i was actually able to convince them otherwise by explaining the situation more deeply

        also i went to the instagrams of a few celebrities that made pro-israel posts and their last non-disabled comment sections were all spammed to the brim with free palestine stuff lmao

    • Awoo [she/her]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      43
      ·
      1 year ago

      Nah shit was waaaaaaaaaaaay fucking worse with Iraq and Afghanistan openly calling people removed and open islamophobia and racism against arabs was perfectly acceptable, even commonplace in average conversation with basically any american. It was all over tv, it was everywhere. Things are definitely different now… Instead they’re controlling people by tapping into performative morality and performative outrage as social signals people adhere to and all dance along like good little puppets.

      • krolden@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        17
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        pretty much but at least back then there still seemed to be a thriving leftist anti-imperialist mindset among the people that sadly seems to have been lost since the crushing of the OWS protests.

          • krolden@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            10
            ·
            1 year ago

            how do you figure? it feels like everyone who gave a shit back then are now either chuds, dead, or were spooked

            • coeliacmccarthy [he/him]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              42
              ·
              edit-2
              1 year ago

              I’m still here babe, just a deeply mentally ill hermit in montana

              Imagine now, except the farthest left content on the entire internet is The Young Turks and 93% of everyone around you supports Bush and you don’t even have a bunch of online weirdos to commiserate with

              • axont [she/her, comrade/them]@hexbear.net
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                30
                ·
                edit-2
                1 year ago

                There was an online communist left back then but it was comprised entirely of very elderly Trotskyites running newsletters with 2 subscribers or very odd academics who ran IRC chat rooms with struggle sessions lasting for literal years

                I remember as a youngster stumbling into one of their forums in like 2003 and getting banned in my first post because I asked if someone could summarize Bordiga

        • Adkml [he/him]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          12
          ·
          1 year ago

          And the eagle will fly man, it’s gonna be hell When you hear mother freedom start ringin’ her bell And it feels like the whole wide world is raining down on you Brought to you courtesy of the red white and blue

          The top song in the country was about how if you messed with America we’d bomb you so bad you’d think the sky was falling.

          And that’s not including the line in the same song “well put a boot in your ass it’s the american way”

          I wonder if the taliban appreciate how fully they did destroy at least the culture and soul of America on 9-11.

            • Adkml [he/him]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              9
              ·
              1 year ago

              I mean that was absolutely the liberal foreign policy positions at the time so that makes sense.

              Also look up the music video of his dumb ass riding around in a humvee wearing neos glasses from the matrix.

    • UlyssesT [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      27
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      9/11 had more popular Islamophobic support. It was almost universal and it frightened me to be surrounded by it. I had to keep very quiet because I knew no one that openly opposed the bloodlust, including the desire to invade countries that had nothing to do with it.

      9/11 also turned the nascent “New Atheist” movement into just another reactionary front. The so-called “Horsemen” that were leading personalities (with maybe one exception) were all aboard the war train.

    • hotcouchguy [he/him]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      26
      ·
      1 year ago

      Yeah basically. And the most likely outcome IMO is Israel has it’s own war on terror jr. and it goes just as well for everyone involved.

      • robot_dog_with_gun [they/them]@hexbear.net
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        16
        ·
        1 year ago

        i don’t know exactly when it was but i remember reading in probably an AP wire story that “curveball” wasn’t reliable and having some understanding that iraq didn’t have shit to do with 9/11.

        the support for invasion of iraq,the paranoid racism, and the expansion of the police state all seem worse in hindsight because i was largely sheltered from all of it.

        • Yeah it probably was worse then but this still feels weirder in the sense that back then it was just the normal flag perverts humping the amerikkka

          Now we’ve got all this flag cuck kink shit where the flag perverts are waving the Israeli and Ukrainian flags and it’s kinda scary in a different way

    • AssortedBiscuits [they/them]@hexbear.net
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      13
      ·
      1 year ago

      It was overall worse. The fact that you could have pro-Palestinian protests right now without people getting killed means it’s already better. If you had an anti-Afghanistan invasion protest right at 2001 when the invasion happened, so literally 22 years ago from this date, your entire group of protestors would’ve 100% been lynched on the spot by an angry mob.

      It was that bad.

        • AssortedBiscuits [they/them]@hexbear.net
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          4
          ·
          1 year ago

          There wasn’t any lynchings because they weren’t any antiwar protests in 2001-10 period. Anti-war protests only started to happen when the US invaded Iraq. Compared that with right now where you just had pro-Palestinian protests at NYC. The political climate is completely different.

          • There wasn’t any lynchings because they weren’t any antiwar protests in 2001-10 period. Anti-war protests only started to happen when the US invaded Iraq.

            What you said breaks my brain … can you please correct and elaborate your points again because even if what you said was true, anti-war protests coud’ve started in the mid 2000s, according to your logic, after the invasion of Iraq, and the explain to me how the political climates before and now is completely different anyhow?

            • AssortedBiscuits [they/them]@hexbear.net
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              8
              ·
              1 year ago

              No, I mean October 2001, which was when Afghanistan was invaded. I didn’t mean 2001-2010. There weren’t antiwar protests in October 2001. Antiwar protests only started becoming a thing after the invasion of Iraq in March 2003. So, it took around a year and a half after 9/11 before you were allowed to have antiwar protests.