I think the problem with the quote is even more fundamental, because it’s basically doing the D&D “some beings are just ontologically evil” thing with the later-D&D “complexity” of “but what if there are, sometimes, exceptions who overcome their tainted blood to become ontologically good” in a way that also effectively absolves Paarthurnax of guilt for his own crimes by just going “lmao, just dragon nature, nothing I could do you see, had to really work my way up to neutral from ontologically evil you know!”
It’s also shitty writing because it dodges the question of guilt altogether: the argument becomes about some sort of internal being-good-and-thinking-good vs being-bad-and-thinking-bad dichotomy instead of the material effects of his actions and the factions he materially aided or opposed. As part of the hegemonic dragon empire Paarthurnax would have done monstrous things, fought to maintain an ontologically evil system, and personally benefited considerably from that system, and the only question is whether switching sides at the end and then entering a self-imposed exile is enough to redeem him and absolve him of guilt.
Also he’s still a monarchist after all that time and thus is still ontologically evil anyways, so he’s not even good he’s just worked his way up from “literally eats people” to “at least tacitly supports a system that figuratively eats people.”
I agree with you pretty much entirely; I only had the direct quote and setting to work with, though. And that setting is full of “born special” bullshit like the Dragonborn.
Honestly it just finally crystalized for me why that quote has always pissed me off when redditors hold it up as some sort of deep philosophical statement when it is, at best, a cheap rehashing of the also-hacky Clockwork Orange theme of being made to be good vs choosing to be good, and I had to articulate it while it was fresh in my mind.
You were right to do so; without further context it may have sounded like I was also nodding along to the born-good-born-evil-except-extra-special-chosen-ones-like-Drizzt bullshit.
All that talk of born-good and born-evil makes me think of this.
I think the problem with the quote is even more fundamental, because it’s basically doing the D&D “some beings are just ontologically evil” thing with the later-D&D “complexity” of “but what if there are, sometimes, exceptions who overcome their tainted blood to become ontologically good” in a way that also effectively absolves Paarthurnax of guilt for his own crimes by just going “lmao, just dragon nature, nothing I could do you see, had to really work my way up to neutral from ontologically evil you know!”
It’s also shitty writing because it dodges the question of guilt altogether: the argument becomes about some sort of internal being-good-and-thinking-good vs being-bad-and-thinking-bad dichotomy instead of the material effects of his actions and the factions he materially aided or opposed. As part of the hegemonic dragon empire Paarthurnax would have done monstrous things, fought to maintain an ontologically evil system, and personally benefited considerably from that system, and the only question is whether switching sides at the end and then entering a self-imposed exile is enough to redeem him and absolve him of guilt.
Also he’s still a monarchist after all that time and thus is still ontologically evil anyways, so he’s not even good he’s just worked his way up from “literally eats people” to “at least tacitly supports a system that figuratively eats people.”
I agree with you pretty much entirely; I only had the direct quote and setting to work with, though. And that setting is full of “born special” bullshit like the Dragonborn.
Honestly it just finally crystalized for me why that quote has always pissed me off when redditors hold it up as some sort of deep philosophical statement when it is, at best, a cheap rehashing of the also-hacky Clockwork Orange theme of being made to be good vs choosing to be good, and I had to articulate it while it was fresh in my mind.
You were right to do so; without further context it may have sounded like I was also nodding along to the born-good-born-evil-except-extra-special-chosen-ones-like-Drizzt bullshit.
All that talk of born-good and born-evil makes me think of this.
https://existentialcomics.com/comic/175