Frodo carried it all the way there. Frodo spared Gollum’s life when he wanted sooo bad to kill him instead. He had remembered Gandalf’s words: “it was pity that stayed Bilbo’s hand.” It was Frodo’s mercy in sparing Gollum’s life that destroyed the ring. Had he chosen to kill Gollum then the ring would’ve survived and the cycle of violence would’ve continued.
Frodo was a hero not only because he was courageous in the face of overwhelming odds. He was a hero because he was merciful. By sparing Gollum’s life, he never allowed himself to be tainted by the ring’s dark logic: that ends always justify means.
its still probably a mistake to be merciful to those who want to hurt you, on the off chance that the way they hurt you might end up bypassing the defenses of some cosmic horror
That sort of thinking is why we have people like Putin in this world. If you want to build a peaceful society you’re going to have to take risks and trust people without all the information.
Everyone for themselves bunker mentality is the way of the jungle, not civilization.
Tolkien’s lesson was not “turn the other cheek every time.” By all means, restrain Gollum from hurting you. Drive him away and ostracize him. But to justify killing him is a different matter entirely.
you just took his most precious possession, he’s not exactly going to stop coming after you and in real life he doesn’t instead decide to help you and kill himself
stories like this are important as they inspire better behavior but making decisions like this should be done with a clear understanding you’re gonna fuck yourself
I didn’t say anything about solitary! Don’t put words in my mouth.
We as a society have laws. People who break those laws go to jail. This functions as a method of restraining them from harming us. We could decide to just kill them instead!
But we don’t!
And of course I feel the need to remind you that my original point was in regards to Frodo’s status as a hero. Most people aren’t heroes and never will be. Tolkien believed that society needs heroes to look up to for moral guidance.
At the same time, he was redefining what it means to be a hero. He believed that the old idea of a hero, one who seeks glory and honour, was a bad ideal. In response he created the modern ideal of a reluctant hero who is selfless, not glory-seeking.
You must not have read LotR too closely if you didn’t think Frodo suffered. He was stabbed by the Morgul-knife which left a wound that pained him for the rest of his life. He was bit by Shelob with a paralyzing bite that left him listless. He lost his finger to Gollum and never got it back.
When he returned to the Shire (and settled down after the scouring of the Shire) he found he could no longer find happiness in daily life. He suffered intensely with PTSD and the pain of his old wounds. When he was offered the opportunity to sail off to the undying lands (home of the Valar and the place to which all elves were leaving Middle Earth for) he took it. This was him admitting he could no longer live a happy, normal life among people who had not felt the trauma of war as deeply as he had.
Frodo carried it all the way there. Frodo spared Gollum’s life when he wanted sooo bad to kill him instead. He had remembered Gandalf’s words: “it was pity that stayed Bilbo’s hand.” It was Frodo’s mercy in sparing Gollum’s life that destroyed the ring. Had he chosen to kill Gollum then the ring would’ve survived and the cycle of violence would’ve continued.
Frodo was a hero not only because he was courageous in the face of overwhelming odds. He was a hero because he was merciful. By sparing Gollum’s life, he never allowed himself to be tainted by the ring’s dark logic: that ends always justify means.
its still probably a mistake to be merciful to those who want to hurt you, on the off chance that the way they hurt you might end up bypassing the defenses of some cosmic horror
That sort of thinking is why we have people like Putin in this world. If you want to build a peaceful society you’re going to have to take risks and trust people without all the information.
Everyone for themselves bunker mentality is the way of the jungle, not civilization.
please don’t mix up fiction and reality
game theory and human nature studies show reality shits on constantly turning the other cheek
Tolkien’s lesson was not “turn the other cheek every time.” By all means, restrain Gollum from hurting you. Drive him away and ostracize him. But to justify killing him is a different matter entirely.
putting golem in solitary isn’t a mercy
you just took his most precious possession, he’s not exactly going to stop coming after you and in real life he doesn’t instead decide to help you and kill himself
stories like this are important as they inspire better behavior but making decisions like this should be done with a clear understanding you’re gonna fuck yourself
I didn’t say anything about solitary! Don’t put words in my mouth.
We as a society have laws. People who break those laws go to jail. This functions as a method of restraining them from harming us. We could decide to just kill them instead!
But we don’t!
And of course I feel the need to remind you that my original point was in regards to Frodo’s status as a hero. Most people aren’t heroes and never will be. Tolkien believed that society needs heroes to look up to for moral guidance.
At the same time, he was redefining what it means to be a hero. He believed that the old idea of a hero, one who seeks glory and honour, was a bad ideal. In response he created the modern ideal of a reluctant hero who is selfless, not glory-seeking.
sorry the solitary was tongue in cheek
but don’t use the word laws around here, don’t you know they are only threats made by the dominant socioeconomic-ethnic group in a given nation
as to frodo being a hero I agree, heroes in a story also rarely suffer for their poor judgement and stuff just works out
You must not have read LotR too closely if you didn’t think Frodo suffered. He was stabbed by the Morgul-knife which left a wound that pained him for the rest of his life. He was bit by Shelob with a paralyzing bite that left him listless. He lost his finger to Gollum and never got it back.
When he returned to the Shire (and settled down after the scouring of the Shire) he found he could no longer find happiness in daily life. He suffered intensely with PTSD and the pain of his old wounds. When he was offered the opportunity to sail off to the undying lands (home of the Valar and the place to which all elves were leaving Middle Earth for) he took it. This was him admitting he could no longer live a happy, normal life among people who had not felt the trauma of war as deeply as he had.