Hi,
jlai.lu is the french instance of Lemmy, some user posted this thread 16 days ago : https://jlai.lu/post/11504685, and a flamewar ensued between hexbear and the french, e.g. between happybadger and their administrator here.
Since they didn’t really have any reason to defederate initially, they’re now adamant that they should defederate only because of this discussion, since it proved that every Hexbear&Lemmygrad user is agressive(, as if jlai.lu users weren’t agressive in this discussion as well).
I still find hard to believe that they could defederate on such weak basis, and it does feel like a convenient excuse, but that’s what they’re saying, ask them for confirmation if you don’t believe it either.
They also used a list of post found on /c/MeanwhileOnGrad@sh.itjust.works as if it was representative, but it hardly counts as an argument, what a stupid situation…
They’ve now pinned this post for 12 days, and the defederation with both Hexbear and Lemmygrad seems unavoidable.
I’ve known this for more than a week but didn’t care that much, yet when talking with them, and especially @Camus here, they/he said that they/he would like to talk to you. @Camus is very patient/nice, and you can look at his number of comments/posts to gauge his influence, probably their most active user(, kind of a french ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆).
Well, to be more precise, he informally asked for some excuses from Hexbear, but my post here didn’t reach them, perhaps because of “r*tard” in my username(, r*tardataire designate someone who’s late in french).
However, more than excuses in the name of others, you only have to show him that we’re not aggressive(, if you have some time, it won’t change much in the end), something very easy/natural to prove for >90% of Hexbear users(, and perhaps >70-80% of Lemmygrad 🙂, it does feel a bit more bitter/serious here, not a criticism).
They have some communities that aren’t that far apart from what could be found on Lemmygrad or Hexbear b.t.w., so it can’t really be said that they’d reject us solely based on terrorism apologia, supporting Stalin, etc.(, even if their “leftist” admin is against socialist countries because our capitalists said that they’re authoritarian).
Staying federated with a french instance would be useless for 99% of Hexbear and Lemmygrad, so if you intervene it’d mostly be on the behalf of current/future french users(, it can be nice sometimes to speak your native language without using an alt account), and perhaps also for Lemmygrad and Hexbear’s reputation on jlai.lu.
If you’re french, and/or simply nice, and want a chat with them, feel free to do so directly under the post or with @Camus.
(Kinda worth mentionning in passing that, currently, their top two posts of all time sorted by the most comments are the ones cited above about this defederation)
Also, keep in mind that this defederation is unavoidable though, if it doesn’t happen now it’ll be next year or the year after. As you know, reddit banned ChapoTrapHouse, GenZedong, etc., and we were quickly banned from lemmy.world and others, so we’ll one day be banned from other “centrist” instances such as the french one. Just like we’d also be banned/censored by our governement if our numbers grow enough to disturb/‘be a threat’.
Furthermore, Hexbear took action, and decided to defederate first without even trying to discuss more calmly. So don’t waste too much of your time either(, but please don’t go there unless you intent to speak calmly).
Thanks for reading :) !
Correction : Someone states a French speaking community should be defederated on the basis of being pro-French
If you really hate the current actions of France then we have the same “values”/beliefs/ideology
An example : Most people here would have probably appreciated some of the warnings emitted from our president towards Israel(, even if, let’s be honest we’re still far from it), that’s only an example, they’re against our actions and what we’re ending up representing.
“It’s a rare french win” isn’t heard very often around here.
This is not what was posted or claimed.
Define the actions of France. Is that of the French government? Is that of the French people? If it is of the French people considering there is basically a third econoLibs, a third racist and a third normal people in France at the moment, which third are you referring to? When considering the neoliberals, are you splitting the ones who are really neoliberals and the ones who just had neoliberal propaganda dumped onto them?
I personally despise what the French government is up to, the country’s current constitution and its authoritarian uses. But French people / France is also Solidaires/SUD, bars like le saint sauveur in Paris (historic antifa bar)… People are not a stable mix, and you can take the most hideous imperialistic regime and still find decent people in the country. Rejection of people or communities based on prejudice and labelling is scaringly close to racism.
That’s how i’m understanding it since i signed up here on Lemmygrad, and not only for the fr*nch, but for amerikkans and every westerner as well.
Many people here are american and are rightfully criticizing our imperialism, it’s not xenophobism towards themselves.
As for the rest of your (pertinent )answer i have a simple question that may help me in understanding your position(, or you to understand mine) : If Mélenchon, Poutou, Arthaud, …, come into power and somehow miraculously manages to change the course of France(, one could dream). Wouldn’t Lemmygrad users say that France is awesome now ? Or would they need to say that “some french people are awesome” ?
You may be right to want to put some nuances in this, but it’s an understandable shortcut, you define France by its government, medias, and the propaganda believed by the overwhelming majority of its population, seems like a fair shortcut, and if you’re a french anti-imperialist, then be welcomed here, but you’re an exception in France(, and knows it).
Yes and no. You don’t define a Lemmy community or a group of people like that. You may at best define a country, but that wasn’t what I pointed out, nor is it what was stated.
No. That’s the whole point. Because as soon as that line of thought is cautioned, you only need a drop of social or economic domination to create a racist trend.
Then is it wrong to say that nazi Germany was bad ? We should say that “some germans were bad” ?
Once again you’re certainly right to nuance, but could understand why people use shortcuts, and you probably used them as well(, i did).
I know that not all iranians or chinese or russians are awesome, but i do love their countries, because of their government’s actions, and regularly claim that Iran, Russia, China, the Alliance of Sahel States, and many more countries/federations, are awesome
(i’d undeniably prefer if the Alliance of Sahel States lived in peace alongside islamists though, nothing’s easy, and i do recognize on the other side that it’s happening on the fringes of the historic territory of islamism, and that we should leave some room for africans to (re)create their own uniqueness that goes beyond any other ideology, ‘one day’/soon perhaps, for now they’re still choosing between “liberalism”, socialism, and islamism, i don’t see their fourth way but it can only be temporary if they continue to ‘make room’&search for it)
Still a good point/warning though(, even if it’s more for intra-national groups) :
Yet if you’re anti-imperialist then you’re anti-France(≃anti-french), just like americans here are anti-amerikka(≃anti-americans), a shortcut to say that you’re against our imperialist actions and propaganda.
That’s why historically we’re called anti-patriotic, while we’re simply patriotic towards another France than the current one(, and real patriots are internationalists anyway i.m.h.o.).