I don’t mind progressives staying home in 2016 to send the message to the DNC that a more progressive candidate was needed.
What I have a problem with is those same progressives showing up for Biden in record numbers in 2020, which sends a conflicting message to the DNC that you do need to put up a white moderate against Trump, and then staying home in 2024 when another moderate is on the ticket.
I hear you Bernie bros, I wish Bernie had been on the ticket in 2016 as well, but we’ll never know whether he would have beat Trump in the general. I would have rather given Trump four more years in 2020, then have to still deal with him now.
If he had just won in 2020, then we wouldn’t have had a violent insurrection that WILL happen again because it was validated by re-electing this guy and failing to hold him accountable.
Now it’s both totally unclear whether a progressive candidate could actually win in the general, and we have to deal with Trump until 2028. If the Democrats put up a progressive candidate like an AOC for 2028 and still lose… Then we’re completely fucked and would have to swing moderate again in 2032… would progressives still stay home out of protest if it’s shown that progressive policies are unpopular in the general election? Or would progressives finally agree to get behind a moderate candidate?
To be clear, I hope the Democratic primaries for 2028 do yield a more progressive candidate, and that they do win the general, but this is a really dangerous gamble. I hope the nation, world and vulnerable groups can hang on while we see if it will pay off.
All I know is, and I know I’ll get destroyed for this kinda proving my point, but I’ve never seen so much division, insults, hate, and even racism, thrown around by leftists to other leftists, than I have in this election. The intolerance and in fighting is through the roof.
For a non-American this thread and other like this are hilarious: the people who spent the last year campaigning “Vote Not Trump” now blame everybody else but themselves for how their strategy of having a candidate who did nothing to appeal to voters and sold fear of the other instead, failed miserably.
So they post tons of such “it’s the fault of everybody else” memes as topics were they and other members of the tribe make posts with wild ass reasons for why it really is everybody else’s faults and responding to such posts from others by basically saying “yeah, you’re so right”, like one gigantic circle jerk, pretty much a continuation of what they were doing for a whole fucking year - a big fat circle jerk whilst not paying attention to anybody else - only now they’re doing it with sad faces.
Sure, it’s the 14 millions who stayed home that are to blame, not the massive incompetence of the DNC and the mindless tribalist muppets trading dumb Trump and Vance memes whilst thinking that their “leaders” deserved a win merelly for wearing the right pin on their jacket and not being Trump, without needing to actually have policies that appealed to their natural voters.
“Bloody natural Democrat voters, not going to polls and doing what they’re supposed to do!”
What a heady, heady mix of stupidity and sense of entitlement.
Reminds me of the whole saying: “Only two things are infinite - the Universe and Human Stupidity - and we’re not sure about the first”
The message was loud and clear: America writ large is not ready for anything less than a straight, white, male president. Its time to stop being delusional, Obama was a fluke, and not going to be repeated. You might not like hearing it, but its the reality on the ground, don’t take it from me.
In retrospect, I think Biden could have shat himself on live TV while asleep at the podium and probably have still gotten elected, the bar was so, so low. Kamala basically ran a prefect campaign, its just not what America wants.
I heard plenty of jokes from Democrats who said when voting for Obama that they were voting for his white half. So your not wrong.
Yeah that could be true, or it might also be true that people don’t like corporate Democrats. Or maybe other issues are important. Maybe Harris was weak on Palestine. Maybe it mattered that the old man took so long to get himself out of the race. Maybe the fact that felons can’t vote played a role. Maybe the electoral college was a factor.
Wait a second, we can go on and on and come up with all of these reasons that you don’t think matter at all, but everyone else knows they do.
Obama was a once in many generation politician, he had charisma and appeal no democrat president ever had. Democrats better field a white straight male from now on if they want to win, forget women president for 3-4 decades now. The kind of misogyny in america is crazy, I am from India, a third world country and even we had a female Prime Minister in our 75 year of independent history, and she was very much respected and one of the most popular. America in its 250 year of history had none, thats just crazy for a so called superpower
Obama was and is and always will be a centrist playing the role of a leftist. Romneycare watered down with extreme Republican ramrodding torpedoeing their own policies into Romneycare-lite and Obama still went with it. That’s some of the reasons why people hate hate and really hate corpo dems and their nominees. Either voters get turned off or turned away or turned against.
Kamala and DNC are to blame for this mess.
This post proves Bernie Sanders right about at least one person.
Kamala basically ran a perfect campaign? I would be shocked if you could name one policy idea of hers and the implementation planned for it.
When did you fuckers started caring about policies? Concepts of a plans, that’s what matters apparently, and that’s what you deserve. She probably did herself a disservice even talking about any policies at all, you braindead morons fell asleap the second she started. Well you personally did, since you can’t name even one
Don’t waste your time arguing with morons from .ml.
The guy won the popular vote. The people who sat the election out would probably have broken for Trump too.
The problem here isn’t voter turnout, it’s voter preference for a fascist.
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That’s just not true. You have no idea what the people who stayed home would have done if they were forced to vote. You have no idea how the campaign would have turned out if Harris had tried to win the popular vote.
Actually, the problem appears to be exactly voter turn out. With a healthy heaping of Neo-Liberal rot in the Democratic Party.
Sure, because everyone who stayed home was a democrat. Every Republican voted.
Pretty much 15 million people didn’t vote this election who voted in 2020. Major difference was every one was home. A good bit of people had nothing to do in 2020. 2024 we had to work and a life not a good reason but turns out without a national holiday with everyone off but emergency services. 15 million less people voted.
Pretty much every republican voted except 2-3 million. 11-12 million democrats were doing other things this year
The “genocide” propaganda worked, and now Trump will help Netanyahu expand it.
Republican voter base is most likely to have the motivation or resources or both to go to the voting booth to vote for Drumpf. All other voters need a convincing reason to lose out their paycheck to go vote at risk of losing their job. Dems and Kamala are to blame. Not the voters.
Alright! So Palestine is free now, right guys?..right?
Palestine is freed… from existing.
The genocide will finally stop!
Because there won’t be anyone left to kill
Of course they are! The non-voters and 3rd party voters did exactly what they said they’d do to free Palestine and now It’s all flowers and hugs as far as the eye can see over there!
Don’t mind the big sign in right in the center of their city that reads “Future Site of Giant Crater”, that’s nothing at all to worry about. Just focus on all the hugs!
Everyone in north Gaza will be dead by new years because of the intentional famine. And it will happen completely under Biden without Trump even getting to the White House.
The community is literally dying and all you can do is throw insults.
Ima be blunt. They would treat me exactly the same as republicans will, because im a trans woman so fuck me. Who it is does actually matter
Let’s meet back here on Jan 1st so I can say you’re full of shit directly to you.
I’m done arguing with you on this.
The UN isn’t lying when they said north Gaza has had no food delivered for weeks and the IDF isn’t lying when they said anyone left alive there who didn’t evacuate is an enemy combatant. The “Generals strategy” is playing out in Israel.
We’re all pissed that Trump won but don’t take it out on others who are also suffering alongside you.
I said I’m done arguing with you on this. You keep coming back for more. Walk away.
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I’m not playing the “but you keep responding to my trolling” game with you. I told you to drop it.
Now drop it.
If Kamala lost the election because she wasn’t in support of Palestine then why didn’t she just support Palestine?
That’s not why she lost the election. The whole “Democrats support genocide!” meme was a propaganda technique to suppress Dem voter turnout. It had an effect, but on its own, I don’t think it was decisive. Sadly, most Americans, including Democrats and progressive, don’t give a shit about the Palestinians, except to cry crocodile tears. And the vast majority of the Republicans are fine with further expanding the genocide.
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I agree with you, but if you look at the above comment, so many downvotes indicate that many other people wildly disagree with you. They honestly believed that the election would swing on single issue Palestine voters, they swore up and down that was the case, and I don’t think they’re going to take a look in the mirror tomorrow.
Maybe make your one issue election about your country and not others? And I mean if you really cared about Palestine, you wouldn’t have stood off to the side and let Trump through, cause now you’ll get to watch the complete annihilation of Palestine, and even more of your tax dollars will go towards the genocide
With Kamala you had someone you could work with and who responds to bad press and would have buckled to your demands. Now you got Trump who gives zero fucks about what you don’t like
I’m not American and you didn’t answer my question.
If pro-palestinian one issue voters lost Kamala the election, why didn’t she appease them? Why are the voters to blame and not the democrats?
Im an Israeli anarchist, but I’m still going to try my best at explaining.
American liberals won’t ever appease leftists, or minorities, because they expect subservience and loyalty for nothing in return. In so doing they play right into the fascists’ hands, trying to serve right wingers who already made their minds up in voting for a fascist.
It is very likely not only more leftists but more Muslim and arabic people would’ve voted for dems if it weren’t for dems insisting that kamala should keep supporting israel and that criticism is amount to betrayal.
As much as i despise electoralism, being an anarchist and all, it’s very simple to understand how and why this happened even from an electoralist perspective, makes one think maybe american liberals just don’t want to understand.
And before anyone says I’m talking out of my ass about american libs, as if i don’t know them because I don’t live in the states: Know that they walk and talk just the same as israeli liberals, and these empty platitudes and threats of being a traitor are the same as i get at home.
Because in the coalition of Democratic voters and donors, there are also those who unconditionally support Israel, and they outnumber those who support the Palestinians.
Answers to your comment are hilarious, these people deserve Trump but they don’t even realise this. Rats complaining about cockroaches.
Because they shouldn’t have beeded to be convinced. Trump was obviously the worse choice for Palestine. The most basic realpolitik shouldve told them to hold their nose. They are to blame for putting their ideals over the lives of everyone around them and even those they want to save.
That’s an excellent question. The Harris campaign decided to not let Palestinians speak at the DNC. The Uncommitted movement offered to endorse her but the staff refused to let any Palestinian Americans do so on camera, even with pre-vetted remarks. It’s mystifying and one of the major blunders of the Harris campaign.
Harris seemed hyper focused on avoiding any criticism by Trump or Republicans. Hence she wouldn’t meet with Palestinian-Americans and avoided all the Muslim voters in Pennsylvania who were trying to meet with her. She was working so hard to get Republicans to flip and support her, which is why she did a rally with Liz Cheney and talked about how much she’d help Israel, and decided the Arab-American and Muslim-American votes were expendable if it meant getting more Republicans.
Hillary tried the same strategy in 2016, and it failed badly. Throwing one of the most loyal democratic voting blocs under the bus to get Republicans to flip for them, has been a strategy of 2 of the last 3 elections (Biden promised to undo the Muslim ban but nothing else, so I don’t know if that counts) and they keep repeating this playbook with the same results. I fear that in 2028 they won’t even try to get our votes again and will try to cozy up to Trump’s Muslim ban in hopes that Republicans flip to democrat once again.
Harris seemed hyper focused on avoiding any criticism by Trump or Republicans.
Compare that with, “They are unanimous in their hate for me — and I welcome their hatred.” That line came from some four-term-President loser.
It wasn’t the one issue, it was just the one that stuck with people who needed an excuse to not show up and vote for a woman.
I think i can copy paste this comment somewhere on a 2016 thread about Hilary and it would make just as much sense.
How about you tell this to someone who isn’t white, or better yet, someone who has family affected by the situation in gaza.
They answered your question perfectly.
I’m not American
then please shut the fuck up.
I suppose that is one way to misread what was typed. GJ
What are you saying then?
I already said it…it isn’t my job to make you read it better. If you actually want to know then you will try again and do better, if not then you can shout into the void until you feel better.
sick bro
“He didn’t elaborate on what would be ‘nasty.’”
Bullies usually don’t elaborate. Being vague lets you fill in your own demons, which is more frightening.
Also plausible deniability when the thugs he’s whistling to go out and bash gays or blacks or Mexicans or whoever (athough in their minds he was giving them permission). “I never said go bash heads. No, I meant nasty as in peacefully, as in not sugarcoating the hard truth, which can be nasty.”
Fascist country
Always has been
Ah yes the free Palestine crowd…lol wait until they see what Israel will do with no US restraint demands.
Well, what’s important is that Harris never listened to people who care about Palestinians. Surely, we will all be better off that the Harris campaign decided to hew closely to Biden’s policies, court Republicans for her cabinet and chase suburban Trump voters. Clearly, this is entirely the fault of individual voters, and we all agree that the campaign, corporate media organizations and monied interests bear no responsibility for this whatsoever.
Whats important is the outcome of policy. Frankly, Gaza is a fucking excuse. You didnt wanna show up, whatever the reason, and you were perfectly happy to sell all the women and non-whites and lgbt folks and everyone else outside of the
AryanMurican master race up the river. Including the fucking Palestinians. Trump will be worse for them. We all know this, it is not up for debate. Yet instead of try ro mitigate this genocide you care so much about, you use them as a shield to justify your inaction. Every single Harris voter was willing to do more for Palestine than you are ever going to be capable of.Well we know that’s not true. Harris herself was in fact a Harris voter, she had so many chances to take a clear stance on Palestine, and she waited until the very end to even try.
And you have no idea what the previous commenter has done with their life. It’s easy to say that someone on the internet never did anything other than vote third party or stay home, but you just don’t know. There are many wonderful human beings who don’t vote how we might appreciate but actually are working hard to make their community a better place.
What’s important is that you’re wrong and this line of thinking leads to things getting worse
Weird, seems like it’s been the repeated denial of progressive issues while courting further and further right that has cost the Democrats the four of the past seven elections, no matter how much we beg for the slightest crumb of civil rights.
I remember how much we had to fight Democrats to get Gay Marriage and LGBT rights in general, and have seen how far they have fled from unions and healthcare. And I say this as someone who has actually done phone banking for the Dems, and has been telling people who are personally invested in what happens to people in Palestine that Harris is the best option on the ballot.
But, yeah, I guess individual voters are the best people to blame, and complaining that people cared enough about an issue to get out and do political action are the problem, and we should smugly congratulate ourselves that they should have just shut up and got with the program, their friends and family members be damned.
So full of shit. The Dems have been robustly defending your civil rights this whole fucking time. Go check the ACLU’s legislative scorecards: you’ll find virtually every Dem rep and senator with a 100% voting record aligned with the ACLU, and almost zero GOP pols with a 100% grade (I found one senator on the 2020 scorecard at 100%). Some GOP pols, like Josh Hawley, score 0%.
The Dems do the damned work, quietly and diligently. Unions saw their biggest gains in decades under Biden. Real wages rose under Biden, more than inflation, and rose highest for the bottom quintile. There hasn’t been an administration in my lifetime (I’m 56) that has come close.
Young progressives are, for the most part, self-important shits that care more about posturing than actually knowing who is doing the most good for the most people, without conducting destructive purity tests on them. Young Progs don’t show up for midterm votes, and didn’t show up on Tuesday. Thanks for showing up in 2020, but what have you done for the world lately? Old fucks like me show up every goddamned time. Voting is a fucking duty, a bare minimum of effort that young progressives have to be wooed with flowers and candy into exerting. Go skip classes in a tent on the school quad without resulting in ANY CHANGE AT ALL, and preen for your Insta friends.
As a fellow old fuck, surely you must remember Obama publicly opposing gay marriage to win voters, no? And, surely, of like me, you’ve been voting in primaries and “off-year” elections for decades like I have, you must remember the various progressives running for the Dem nomination only to have people like John Kerry and Al Gore be the “exciting, energetic” candidates. Sure, we can point to Clinton, but his strategy involved being conservative enough to pull in Reagan Dems and middle class Republicans, as well as the usual Democratic mainstays. You know, the play the Dems keep running while not having someone with Bill’s “good ole boy” personality to pull it off.
And, yeah, it’s been a breath of fresh air seeing unions do as well as they have recently, after being pounded into the dirt for decades. And, yeah, the economy is doing better, but people still struggle to pay for groceries and housing. Do you remember when George Bush couldn’t answer what the price of milk was, and how hard he got beat up over that? Did you vote in '92? I was too young, but I still remember hearing about the price of milk everywhere for a long stretch there.
I dunno, I’m just kind of tired of voting Blue election after election while getting told the issues that are important to me just can’t be done right now, because we need to appeal enough to Republicans again. Having to fight tooth and nail to get whatever issues some ground, be it civil rights, the environment or social services, and then see it up on the chopping block the moment Dems need to “compromise” with Republicans to not tear up a different right. And we still lose, or win just enough to not have enough of a majority to get anything done. The closest I’ve seen to Dems doing well while I’ve been able to vote? When they embraced the possibility of change and getting things done with Obama’s Hope campaign.
And, again, this is coming from someone who has voted for Harris, votes in primaries and off-year elections, who has done phone banking for the Dems, been involved in local orgs, has advocated to disillusioned voters to get out to the polls to vote because of how awful the alternative for not voting is.
But, you tell me: how successful was the Dem’s strategy this cycle? Did they manage to pick up votes on their right flank? What was the gain in conservative Dem voters vs. the loss in progressives? How does the gap compare to previous elections? What sort of voters did their appeal to “the middle” yield? I’m something of a numbers wonk at the end of the day and tend to be more receptive to the analysis instead of what I see as knee-jerk scapegoating, so tell me what went well this time around.
You’re not a very good troll are you. It’s well established that there are large numbers of corporate Democrats who will float social issues as important but tend to follow through very weakly.
You know, what happened to abortion? That’s an issue that we knew was coming 30 years ago. We were discussing it in the '90s. We knew that the Republicans were trying to poison the Supreme Court, and the Democrats just went along with it, pretending they were helpless when they had enough power to stop it.
And I could bring up other issues where the progressive stance was just ignored by the majority of Washington Democrats. There are so many major issues. Wars, banks, unions, monopolies, etc. But I don’t think you’re interested. I think you’d rather just do a little bit of name calling. Maybe I’m wrong, though. It’s happened before, happens all the time.
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Are you threatening someone with being graped in a concentration camp?
When you lose an election this badly, people are clearly not buying you’re selling.
But damn I did not expect so many people to sit out against the guy who did the coup and amongst all the other shit. If there is any light ahead, I think it’s that this L forces the Democratic Party to lean back left with their campaign promises, and whatever power they have left to affect policy.
If there is any light ahead, I think it’s that this L forces the Democratic Party to lean back left with their campaign promises, and whatever power they have left to affect policy.
John Kerry? Is that you?
They are fucking incapable of learning this.
Bernie polled great against Trump but they snubbed him for Hillary and we lost because of it.
The only reason Biden won was because he wasn’t Trump and we were tired of him at that point.
Kamala had a chance to swing a little more left but continued to try to court moderate conservatives and the suburbs instead.
They just can’t get it through their heads that: Trump and maga are winning as a reaction of “fuck the system”. This mostly stems from corporations and the filthy rich not being taxed enough and us not spending enough on social programs. That energy could have been captured and utilized by running a leftist.
But instead we get milquetoast business as usual bullshit
I think it’s that this L forces the Democratic Party to lean back left with their campaign promises, and whatever power they have left to affect policy.
Yeah, that’s what everyone thought after 2016 as well.
If they go far left they’ll lose all backing and funding, making them completely useless. It’s just the way the system is built. I’m Canadian but I see you guys had a choice to pick a bad but fixable administration, and instead just let the fascist through. I mean you can chide the Democrats all you want for the result, but it was the left who sat out and it’s those same people who are gonna suffer
Bernie Sanders set records for both 2016 and 2020.
The number of Democratic voters is reported to be around 49 million. (link) As of 9 a.m., Vice President Kamala Harris had 66.5 million votes to Trump’s 71.56 million. (link)
Plenty of the left showed up, in 2020 biden got 81,283,501 in the popular vote. That’s near 15 million disenchanted voters who didn’t return to the polls for this administration. But let’s blame the 15 million people, surely they must all be wrong and not the DNC’s strategy or anything.
Meeting Arab American voters is not “far left.” Biden actively diverted his campaign stops in Michigan to avoid meeting them and Harris campaign refused to let Palestinian-Americans endorse her on camera at the DNC.
It’s nor far left to meet Palestinian-Americans and Lebanese Americans who lost loved ones in bombings. Biden routinely met with Israeli-Americans in the White House and family members of hostages and posted photos with them on his instagram. Meeting just ONE Arab-American family is something he never did, and saying that would be a far left thing to do is frankly offensive.
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When are you expecting an election to happen where you can vote for this party?
And with what funding will they rub a campaign if not from PACs
Get started
yall really think democrats learn from this shit? you born yesterday?
Yes, a Very Special Thanks to the morally pure angels who refused to vote for Kamala Harris because they were standing on high ground about some issue they disliked her on. Well done, fuckheads.
It’s kamala’s fault tho /s
It really was (or at least the Democratic party’s fault). If you take every single third party voter, assign them to Kamala, she still loses.
The real problem here is that people needed to be convinced that voting was worth it when Trump was a candidate. How the fuck do you even reach someone with such a pathetic lack of concern for the world? Seriously you people think if she vowed to stop Israel, magically these dip shit knuckle dragging morons would’ve jumped at the chance to vote for her. Millions of people told us they give zero fucks. And fuck them for that.
American voters in general dgaf about things that don’t affect them. Israel is irrelevant to your median American voter.
Yeah I agree. After this result you cannot argue that Americans in general give a flying fuck about their neighbor. It’s fucking pathetic. Zero faith in America, maybe humanity, left here.
That genocide is gonna stop any day now
Didn’t you hear? All Palestinians got a personal check for $1 million straight from trump himself.
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What a repugnant response
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So clever. Not a great speller though. LOoSeR in basically every comment.
“If liberals are so fucking smart why do they lose so goddamn always?”
- Will McAvoy “The Newsroom”
I don’t think it’s fair to blame voters when it’s the politician’s job during s campaign to convince people they’re worth voting for.
Adopting unpopular centrist policies and aligning more and more with centrist Biden’s policies as the campaign went on is just going to fill voters with apathy.
The Democrats, once again, didn’t give us a candidate to vote for, only one to vote against. And I think the American people are sick of that carrot-stick routine, the Dems need to actually adopt popular policies.
And the establishment Dems are going to fight that tooth and nail.
Why did you need to be convinced to vote against Trump?
We didn’t. Most people did. Candidates running for office are a popularity contest. Biden has low approval ratings, Harris said she’s Biden and wouldn’t change most polices.
Trump is much much worse, and I voted for Harris in California despite knowing it didn’t change how North Carolina or Iowa could have gone.
At some point “I’m not Trump” gets tired and going “I’m just like the guy in office who was so unpopular he dropped out, but I will give Republicans what they want on border policy and appoint them to my cabinet” reads more like Diet Trump than “I will give you policies that sway people away from fascism.”
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You have every right to be angry, but your anger is pointed at the wrong people. Just like the elite divide the masses with bullshit culture wars, the Democratic party elite want you to blame your fellow voters rather than their unpopular platform and abysmal campaign.
If you can vote, you’re a fucking adult. stop acting like a fucking god damned spoiled child.
I’ve seen this attitude repeated ad nauseum these last few weeks, from people discussing Harris with conflicted undecided voters. And your attitude and aggression is exactly what all of them received, and yet you all wonder why people may have stayed home?
People were vocal about their complaints regarding the Democrat’s platform, and they were ignored. If democracy is so important, why the fuck couldn’t the Democratic party adopt more progressive policies?!
Like, apparently it’s completely reasonable to expect people to do what you say with no promise of even addressing their concerns, nevermind actually addressing, but it’s completely unreasonable to just choose not to participate in the system?
You’re not entitled to someone’s vote, regardless of the circumstances. Stop blaming your fellow countrymen and women for not feeling represented, and start screaming at the party who fucking refused to represent them.
Stop blaming your fellow Americans for the Democrats running a platform so unpopular, 14 million Democrats that voted in 2020 chose to stay home.
Stop blaming your fellow Americans for the DNC hiding Biden’s mental acuity issues for well over a year, humiliating himself (and our country) on stage at his debate before hastily cramming a candidate the party didn’t have a say in, and running her on policies that their constituents were vocally against.
As a trans woman, you’re damn right I’m fucking terrified, and I’m fucking angry.
But my anger is at the Democratic party, who decided that spending decades appeasing the Republicans and giving the American people nothing that they’ve been promised, who knew the consequences of this election and decided a 2016 rerun was the only viable option, who paraded Republican after Republican across the DNC stage while snubbing Palestinian Democrats from speaking, and then sending Bill Clinton to lecture the electorate about why Israel has the right to genocide Palestine.
The Democratic party had fascism at the gates, and passed all responsibility onto their voting base instead of checks notes listened to their fucking constituents.
So don’t get angry at your disillusioned and apathetic neighbor, they’re a symptom of the system being unrepresentative of the people for so many years.
Direct your anger at the DNC, demand they start listening to their base, demand that they start trying to garner non-voters with popular policies instead of moving further right to appeal to moderate Republicans.
Or better yet, send them letters regularly, like I plan to do, reminding them that all of the awfulness the American people are living through is a direct result of their entitlement and hubris. Maybe throw in their that they could probably get elected if they actually listened to the American people and ran on policy that reflected what they want.
But that’s probably too radical, let’s just keep blaming the electorate for wanting to participate in a system that represent them, not one that runs on “Please, we promise, last time we’re delaying fascism/the other guy, for realz for realz this time, we’ll totally enact all the laws, just give us more money you don’t have and give us four more years.” But, I’m clearly not as educated and smart as the people running the DNC, I mean, I haven’t lost 4 out of the last 7 elections trying to run the same playbook everytime,
They just have to run a candidate people want to vote for, not a candidate people have to vote for. But they won’t, because the DNC seems to think they know what people need better than they do. And their voting results this year clearly show that…
How much did voter purges and other voter-suppression measures contribute to the lower turnout?
A reasonable person votes against the enemy after a certian point, even if that means electing a fucking banana. Why did you need to convinced to vote against Trump? Why wasnt that a given? One of you answer us that please
your response is tone-deaf and meaningless.
this election was an armed robbery and 20 million witnesses just watched it happen because they wanted to “teach the victim a lesson.” how fucked up is that?
I blame the DNC, I blame them for dragging us to this point.
I blame the RNC, I blame them for pushing us to this point.
But most of all, I blame Americans that idly stood by and let this happen. You had the opportunity to swing everything blue. had the opportunity to pressure them for four more years. had the opportunity to set the stage for some real change in 2028.
you fucks sold us up the fucking river for your pride and arrogance.
I’m fucking mad as hell, and you want to tell me where I need to direct my anger? Fuck your arrogant idealistic dream. You want me to direct my anger? How about I direct my fucking anger at you? The one who’s trying to fucking manipulate me into attacking their opposition. I fucking know who I’m mad at.
fuck you, and fuck those 20 million Americans that willfully withheld their votes. I hope every single one of you chokes on your arrogance and pride when you’re fucking starving in the camps those monsters are going to put us in.
this election was an armed robbery and 20 million witnesses
This is just ridiculous, it was not an “armed robbery.” You don’t need to exaggerate to try and make your misguided point.
Even I expected there to be conflict at polling locations, and minus that machete kid, nothing of note made it across my screen.
“teach the victim a lesson.” how fucked up is that?
How fucked up is it to demand someone’s vote while telling them they’re families lives don’t matter? The DNC did that, not anyone else. That’s been their whole play entire fucking campaign.
I blame the DNC, I blame them for dragging us to this point.
I blame the RNC, I blame them for pushing us to this point.
Good, that’s where the blame should be.
You had the opportunity to swing everything blue. had the opportunity to pressure them for four more years.
They pressured them the last two years and the DNC refused to budge on damn near anything.
It wasn’t non-voters who lied about Biden’s mental health. It wasn’t non-voters who pushed him through the majority of the primary while keeping pertinent health information of his secret. It wasn’t non-voters who humiliated their candidate, party, and country during a national debate because they thought they could hide his mental health decline. It wasn’t non-voters who then pushed through a candidate the constituency didn’t nominate, on a platform they didn’t want, while suppressing any criticism of the DNC.
100,000 people cast protest votes in Michigan alone over the Palestinian genocide, which is more than the number of votes Harris lost Michigan by. They put pressure on the DNC to take them seriously and heed their concerns, and what did the non-voters, I’m sorry, the DNC do in response?
They had how many Republicans on stage at their national convention, but no Palestinians? They sent Clinton to lecture Muslim and Arab voters that Israel was justified in their genocide because “self defense.”
had the opportunity to set the stage for some real change in 2028.
The Democrats have promised “real change is just four years away, we promise this time” since I was fucking born. Guess what? That bullshit excuse isn’t flying anymore. Being sold the fucking status quo every fucking election cycle is old, and it’s cost the DNC 4/7 the last elections.
So better they just keep fucking using it and expecting the voters to deal, instead of changing their fucking platform to reflect the populace.
you fucks sold us up the fucking river for your pride and arrogance.
Again, that’s the DNC.
I’m fucking mad as hell, and you want to tell me where I need to direct my anger?
You all demanded everyone vote the way you wanted, regardless of how they felt. So yeah, I am telling you where to direct your fucking anger, and it shouldn’t be at people like me.
Who voted fucking Harris, btw, you fucking twat. Begrudgingly, despite my displeasure with almost everything she stood for. And if you look at my comment history, you’ll see I remained adamant that no one should vote for Trump while still trying to paint a fucking realistic picture of the situation.
Fuck your arrogant idealistic dream.
Didn’t realize “maybe the DNC should have platformed on policies that their constituents were vocal about during the campaign” was an arrogant idealistic dream.
Guess I should just settle for the status quo and hope the party that just showed me they wouldn’t budge will maybe budge in four years.
You seriously hear yourself think this way, and go, “Yep, it’s the people who are wrong, not the party.” Fucking serious?
The one who’s trying to fucking manipulate me into attacking their opposition.
My opposition? This is what’s fucking wrong with you fucking children on this website.
You want some hard fucking truths from someone who’s supposedly your fucking enemy?
NO ONE fucking owes you anything in life. They don’t owe you their protection, they don’t owe you the truth, they don’t owe you fucking anything.
So when you entitled fucking children scream and shout about all the people who didn’t vote, you need to remember that they don’t owe you fucking shit.
You weren’t entitled to anyone’s vote simply by virtue of wanting to stop fascism, so fuck right off with this entitlement that all fucking liberal elite assholes seem to think they deserve.
Harris was not entitled to anyone’s fucking vote, she needed to fucking earn them. Which I thought was the whole reason I got fucking 12 fucking emails every day telling me how much they need more money.
But they fucking didn’t, and now we all suffer the consequences of their fucking arrogance and hubris. And even now, miserable entitled fucks like you actively make me just want to not vote anymore, because you fucking refuse to try and understand anything from anyone’s point of view but your fucking own.
So no, fuck you. Maybe you and the rest of the DNC who seem to know best (but can’t fucking win an election to save their life) will understand that you can’t fucking win an election without votes, and you can’t fucking win votes without appealing to the fucking voters.
That’s not putting forward your platform and demanding they meet you where you are. That’s putting your platform forward, and then fucking modifying to reflect what your base is telling you they want, like a fucking professional fucking adult.
Career politician couldn’t fucking beat a convicted felon fascist who killed over a million Americans, and non-voters are to blame?! Fucking Christ.
This is just ridiculous, it was not an “armed robbery.” You don’t need to exaggerate to try and make your misguided point.
Its called a metaphor
How fucked up is it to demand someone’s vote while telling them they’re families lives don’t matter? The DNC did that, not anyone else. That’s been their whole play entire fucking campaign.
Answer me this. How fucked up is it to tell women and lgbt people that our lives are worth less than people halfway across the world who hate us just as much as Republicans. Because thats what you abstainers did.
They pressured them the last two years and the DNC refused to budge on damn near anything.
If you tried for two years and got nowhere, maybe the blame circles back to yall not accepting a clear “no”.
It wasn’t non-voters who lied about Biden’s mental health. It wasn’t non-voters who pushed him through the majority of the primary while keeping pertinent health information of his secret. It wasn’t non-voters who humiliated their candidate, party, and country during a national debate because they thought they could hide his mental health decline. It wasn’t non-voters who then pushed through a candidate the constituency didn’t nominate, on a platform they didn’t want, while suppressing any criticism of the DNC.
It wasnt the DNC either. Biden chose to try to run, against the advice of basically everyone around him. On the other hand, you might be the only person who isnt a Republican to give a shit about wanting a primary. Definitely the first Ive encountered.
100,000 people cast protest votes in Michigan alone over the Palestinian genocide, which is more than the number of votes Harris lost Michigan by. They put pressure on the DNC to take them seriously and heed their concerns, and what did the non-voters, I’m sorry, the DNC do in response?
See what I said above about ignoring a clear no, and telling the rest of us marginalized Americans we matter less than Palestine.
The Democrats have promised “real change is just four years away, we promise this time” since I was fucking born. Guess what? That bullshit excuse isn’t flying anymore. Being sold the fucking status quo every fucking election cycle is old, and it’s cost the DNC 4/7 the last elections.
The reason the DNC doesn’t push progressive candidates, above all else, is that progressives cannot be counted on to vote. Why would they appeal to you when they know the moderate conservatives will at least show up.
You all demanded everyone vote the way you wanted, regardless of how they felt. So yeah, I am telling you where to direct your fucking anger, and it shouldn’t be at people like me.
We demanded people vote against an obvious evil which would be worse for Palestine than Harris. That was never up for debate. The most basic of realpolitik should’ve told you all to vote for her regardless if saving Palestinian lives was your goal. As evidended by…
Who voted fucking Harris, btw, you fucking twat.** Begrudgingly, despite my displeasure with almost everything she stood for. And if you look at my comment history, you’ll see I remained adamant that no one should vote for Trump while still trying to paint a fucking realistic picture of the situation.
Congratulations, you get a cookie. Now why couldnt the other 14,999,999 work that one out?
Didn’t realize “maybe the DNC should have platformed on policies that their constituents were vocal about during the campaign” was an arrogant idealistic dream.
Guess I should just settle for the status quo and hope the party that just showed me they wouldn’t budge will maybe budge in four years.
Wanting the DNC to field a more progressive candidate isnt wrong. Expecting them to do so in response to not voting is an idealistic dream, and blaming them for siding with the faction that can be trusted to show up is the arrogance.
You want some hard fucking truths from someone who’s supposedly your fucking enemy?
NO ONE fucking owes you anything in life. They don’t owe you their protection, they don’t owe you the truth, they don’t owe you fucking anything.
Noone owes us protection, but we owe Palestine? That makes sense/ And, tell me again, which candidate was better for them?
So when you entitled fucking children scream and shout about all the people who didn’t vote, you need to remember that they don’t owe you fucking shit.
You weren’t entitled to anyone’s vote simply by virtue of wanting to stop fascism, so fuck right off with this entitlement that all fucking liberal elite assholes seem to think they deserve.
So Im not entitled to anyones vote, as an American trans woman. But Palestine is? You are at best inconsistent, and at worst a hypocrite. And the fact stopping fascism wasnt a good enough sell to earn those votes says more about you than our entitlement
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Utterly bizarre. I expected Trump might squeak out an electoral win, but the popular vote as well? Thanks everyone who stayed the fuck home. You sat by as fascism was ushered in to the US.
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Generations of those who gave everything for our country are rolling
Same. I’m not sure if I’m more… “Ok” with this? We should still abolish the electoral college, but we were shafted by the American people this time (and the propaganda machine making things worse). It’s the first time since I turned 18 that the GOP actually won the popular vote… Sigh
Abolishing the electoral college would require a constitutional amendment, and isn’t even necessary. Passing the National Popular Vote law in a few more states will guarantee that the electoral college always follows the national popular vote. This law has already been passed by 17 states + DC, with a total of 209 electoral votes - already 3/4 of the way there, only 61 more votes needed. Go to the site to see if it already passed in your state.
Bold of you to expect there will be another election.
There will be an election, but Trump will decide who’s eligible in the even-more-controlled opposition.
Now project 25 will swing into action. Then queue all those impacted who voted for the arsewipe to gasp “but he’s hurting the wrong people!”
I heard about that, I just don’t know who else can join the coalition. It might be easier to do it as an amendment if there a massive shift in power over the next decade (and I shudder to think what that’d be that was so upsetting or so lethal that the entire landscape changes to Dems having a super majority).
The NPV only needs states with 61 more electoral votes. In 7 states totaling 74 votes it has already passed half their legislatures (state house or senate but not both). So it’s actually a lot closer than starting from scratch with a constitutional amendment, which would need approval from 3/4 of all states.
Any idea which states might fit the bill?
I don’t remember offhand but if you are interested the site I linked lists the 17 states where it has passed, and the 7 states where it has passed half of their legislature.
I’m on board for this. But with current SCOTUS, I don’t think this would hold up.
And if it did hold up, I think they would also determine that state governments could supercede the will of the people in that particular state in ANY situation which is also scary.
All votes are not counted yet. There’s still a chance he won’t get the popular vote. A tiny chance, but still a chance…
There’s a bigger likelyhood Harris wins the electoral college than the popular vote, but both are pretty unlikely.
Big ups to those people who “voted against genocide”.
Special shout-out to the folks that voted third party because “my state will be blue”
folks that voted third party because “my state will be blue”
Admittedly not all the votes are in, but…
- Pennsylvania - Trump up by 130k votes, Jill Stein got 33k votes
- Michigan - Trump up by 84k votes, Jill Stein got 45k votes
- Wisconsin - Trump up by 28k votes, Jill Stein got 12k votes
Are all Jill Stein votes from protest voters? Nah, there are diehard Green supporters out there.
Are there other 3rd party candidates? Of course, but how many RFK (more votes than Stein in WI) voters could she have converted? Almost none.
This was her blue wall road to victory, show me the electoral path to victory ruined by third party voters who would have otherwise voted Democrat.
This election was lost by people not showing up to vote. Trump is sitting at almost 72M votes right now compared to 74M in 2020. Harris is only at 67M now, compared to Biden’s 81M in 2020. While there are still votes to count, there aren’t 15M votes left to count.
Whether it was lack of interest, protest, or whatever reason, 10% of voters stayed home this year.
I blame the Stein voters exactly as much as I blame the people staying at home. And neither as much as the people who voted for Trump.
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My election registration got canceled three times this year. The last two times it was because of a “duplicate”, and they were counting my canceled registrations as duplicates. I have no idea if my ballot got counted, or if it was discarded.
I vote blue in one of those red states…
Similar here actually. I usually try to vote by mail, but by the time I finally got registeration and residency handled after 2 online registrations and two visits to the elections office, early voting was over, so I had to go to the polls on election day
“Admittedly not all the votes are in, but…” you’ll pretend to make a point with vote counts anyway.
I am so fucking sick of all this shit.
- Pennsylvania - 98.3% Reporting
- Michigan - 98.7% Reporting
- Wisconsin - 99% Reporting
These states have been called for Trump. The remaining outstanding vote will not impact this result. The remaining vote is not going to come in all for Jill Stein or other third party candidates. The point that protest votes for third party candidates did not rob Harris of an electoral college victory will stand once 100% of the vote is in.
Okay, now you’ve supplied enough information to validate what you’re saying. Thanks.
I thought my state would go blue. Went out to vote anyway and voted blue. Brought my spouse out to vote as well. Our state did not go blue. Country is fucked
No state had enough third party votes to flip red to blue had they all gone blue, so can we give this a rest?
The DNC failed, plain and simple.
Wisconsin and Michigan.
And Pennsylvania and Georgia. The so-called swing states really took a wild swing this time.
Got me there, though if you look and tally only the left candidates who might’ve actually gone for Harris otherwise it’s still not true.
And in any case, she still loses even if she got these states.
But they wanna blame someone who doesn’t impact anything! Why blame a bad campaign when you can blame 0.03% of the voters!
It was a good campaign. Maybe it could have been even better, sure, but the amount of Monday night quarterbacking in here is silly.
The only thing I can question about it, I’m not even sure about.
The problem wasn’t anything the campaign did. The problem was that “did joe Biden drop out” was trending on Google the day of the election. Tell me how to reach those people.
Do you think there weren’t enough ads? Not enough door knocking? What exactly, would you have them do?
I don’t think you can educate people who learned Biden dropped out on election night, those people are too stupid to vote. Especially since my YouTube for weeks after Harris was the nominee, I got a lot of donation ads staring her, not once mentioning Biden.
I don’t know if more ads would have gotten her a bigger spotlight, but I do know that its political non-sense to claim to help those who fascist targets, then ignore the calls of those who fascist targets, and then buddy up with subtler-fascists like Dick and Liz Chaney.
Its like she was trying to say “You go along with this, you’re never going to vote for Trump, he hates you, I don’t.” And she was right, they didn’t vote for Trump as he hates them.
No state had enough third party votes to flip red to blue had they all gone blue, so can we give this a rest?
I actually think people who think any part of politics is “plain and simple” are the real problem.
“The real problem” sounds pretty plain and simple that.
Seriously though what are you saying? What’s the point of that statement?
They failed, that’s plain and simple. The cause behind that? Probably more complicated.
Yeah, and since it sounds pretty much that way, it definitely is that way and you win the internet argument, right?
I think the main problem in discussing most issues is that people oversimply them. Memes and meme-level thinking don’t get to the essence of an issue, they just pretend to by expressing a single point of view, reinforcing the false belief that the whole issue is plain and simple, and excusing people for not bothering to exert their brains much before the scroll to the next item in their feed.
What if my state is California?
Who did you vote for?
Taking the data from here and throwing it in a spreadsheet, Trump got more votes than everyone else combined, including the Libertarian party, RFK Jr, and Write-ins.
Looking at that chart, she would have won in Wisconsin and gotten their ten electoral votes.
What does it look like for the rest of the states?
Across the country, it was Trump: 71,825,780 Everyone else: 69,303,000
It says at the top of the page it was last updated a day ago, but I kind of doubt the numbers will change too dramatically.
The other person was making the point that you can’t do it by total popular vote, you have to do it by state and then look at their electoral college votes.
But the electoral college is dumb and pointless. This is the first time a Republican won the popular vote since 2004, or since 1988 if you don’t want to count an incumbent victory. That alone should tell you plenty about the state of the country right now.
Your comment is dumb and pointless, yet here it is.
See how far your logic goes?
It’s dumb and pointless, but it’s literally the way a president is elected today. We have had many instances of people being elected president who didn’t win the popular vote. So if you want to try to figure out if third party candidates caused Trump to get elected, you have to look at it state by state.
But the electoral college is dumb and pointless
And its also how a president is elected in the United States, or 2016 would have gone a bit differently.
67m for Harris to 72m (rounded up) on the BBC; it was really not close eh.
Biden got 81.2 million.
How the fuck are people not voting. After all that.
How the fuck are people not voting.
Massive voter suppression, and propaganda.
Amnesia.
But how do you count “didn’t vote”? And what about “voted on other parts but not for President because genocide or whatever”? That second group might be countable, but the first is like proving a negative
You probably look at how many citizens there are, and look at how many voted. Then do some magic math.
But how do you count “didn’t vote”?
I didn’t, that’s voter turnout and probably won’t be fully available till all the votes are counted. If you’re impatient though, here’s the washington post comparing 2024 voter turnout to 2020.
Honestly, it doesn’t matter, even if every single 3rd party voter went for Harris, Trump still wins
Now count those that didn’t vote at all.
But how else will they blame anyone but themselves?
The meme is literally how else.
Yeah I heard halo polish is on sale at Walmart, they should check it out.
